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Re: enriched-mode and switching major modes.

From: Oliver Scholz
Subject: Re: enriched-mode and switching major modes.
Date: Sat, 18 Sep 2004 22:02:04 +0200
User-agent: Gnus/5.1006 (Gnus v5.10.6) Emacs/21.3.50 (windows-nt)

"Eli Zaretskii" <address@hidden> writes:

>> From: Oliver Scholz <address@hidden>
>> Date: Sat, 18 Sep 2004 19:08:17 +0200
>> Cc: address@hidden, address@hidden, address@hidden
>> It works to some extend, as long as you are able to identify those
>> newlines and space characters when the document is encoded again and
>> written to a file.
> If those characters have a special text property (put there when the
> file is decoded), then such an identification at save time is
> possible.

Yes, that's the technique I have been using so far.  It seems to me
that Richard would disagree here.

> I suggest to discuss that and try to identify the specific problems
> that you think will cause such an approach to fail.  Then we might
> have a better idea of the limitations of this approach, and could talk
> about solutions.

Easy.  Just consider the HTML document attachted below.  RTF has
similar features, but I chose HTML, because that is more widely
known.  To see where the problem is, you need a CSS capable browser
on a GUI.

However, I don't think we need to talk about specific solutions /now/,
for this reason:

> In other words, the current design might indeed have to be changed,
> but I think you will agree that such changes need to be kept to a
> minimum, lest we end up redesigning Emacs.  Talking about specific
> problems will help to come up with such a minimal set of changes.

Yes, I agree.  If all this is basically a question of whether a box
model (in the display engine) is too much work and trouble, then in
fact, I suggest to delay such decisions until basic functionality is
implemented by means of space and newline characters.  Then we'll see
whether what's left is worth it.

I am thinking about an architecture (for word processing) that should
be modular enough to replace the spaces-and-newline box model with
something real without trouble.


Examples where Emacs' display engine would fail

Ich hab' in meinen Jugendtagen wohl auf dem Haupt einen Kranz getragen. Die Blumen glaenzten wunderbar, ein Zauber in dem Kranze war.
Der schoene Kranz gefiel wohl allen, doch der ihn trug hat manchem misfallen. Ich floh den gelben Menschenneid, ich floh in die gruene Waldeinsamkeit.
Im Wald! Im Wald da konnt' ich fuehren ein freies Leben mit Geistern und wilden Tieren: Feen und Hochwild von stolzem Geweih. Sie nahten sich mir ganz ohne Scheu.
Sie nahten sich mir ganz ohne Zagnis; sie wussten das sei kein schreckliches Wagnis. Dass ich kein Jaeger, wusste das Reh. Dass ich kein Vernunftmensch, wusste die Fee.
Oliver Scholz               Jour du Travail de l'Année 212 de la Révolution
Ostendstr. 61               Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité!
60314 Frankfurt a. M.       

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