Re: [gnugo-devel] using problems for regression tests

[Evan Berggren Daniel]

I had been specifically thinking of some of the problems from Get Strong
at Tesuji.  Some of them are interesting because they are tactical
problems that Gnu Go fails.  The book says that the problems are taken
from Tesuji Kyoka Sho published by the Nihon Kiin.  I can't find any info
on that book, however.  Does anyone happen to know whether the problems in
it are copyrighted?  I suppose we could write to Bozulich and ask
permission; I have no idea how receptive he would be to the idea, though.

Thanks for the explanation, Gunnar; it's about what I'd been thinking,
only much more clearly formulated.  Copyright terms in the US are life of
author + 70 years, or date of first publication + 95 years for corporate
authors, with every indication that Congress will increase the terms.

On Fri, 28 Mar 2003, Gunnar Farneback wrote:

> Evan wrote:
> > I was wondering what our policy is on using problems from books for
> > regression testing.
>
> To begin with there is absolutely no problem *using* problems from
> books for testing the engine. The problem comes with *distributing*
> them. Of course the latter is usually critical for our purposes but
> it's important to be aware of the distinction.
>
> > I notice we have some problems from Get Strong at the
> > Endgame; would finding problems Gnu Go has trouble with and entering them
> > in be considered generally acceptable, or are things more complicated than
> > that?
>
> Things are a lot more complicated than that. Without being an expert
> on copyright law (which to some extent also varies between countries),
> I consider the following cases safe enough:
>
> * Problems taken directly from sufficiently old sources are okay.
>   Exactly what sufficiently old means is somewhat difficult to say,
>   however. Currently Swedish law says that copyright protection ends
>   when the author has been dead for 70 years. I believe that the
>   situation is similar also in other parts of the world, including a
>   disturbing trend that the length of protection is extended (it used
>   to be 50 years in Sweden) any time "Mein Kampf" or Mickey Mouse gets
>   close to slipping into the public domain.
>
> * The *ideas* in general and common problems can be used. For
>   example most of the test cases in ld_owl.tst are common life and
>   death problems which occur in lots of life and death books as well
>   as in real games. Compared to the books the configuration of
>   surrounding stones is different (no go book author would ever
>   consider using such an artificial position). However, there is still
>   the matter of potential copyright on the selection of problems,
>   etc., so one shouldn't organize the problems in the same way.
>   The commenting text in books is of course off limits but not
>   interesting for our purposes anyway.
>
> * Problems from books where the author (or more generally copyright
>   owner) has given explicit permission.
>
> * Unusual or complex problems had better be avoided. However, there
>   are some fair use provisions that may be invoked to include sample
>   problems verbatim from other sources. Still we shouldn't rely on
>   this too much.
>
> /Gunnar
>
>
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