Re: [GNUnet-developers] [Gsoc 2015] Project proposal on GNUnet-over-ICMP

[DocMalloc]

You describe _exactly_ the points I thought about 2 hours ago ... there
is definitely preliminary work to do before starting to code. 

Therefore I would like to see a detailed protocol and realization sketch
how to realize this idea including some brief related work
discussion ...

-M


On Thu, 2015-03-19 at 21:33 +0100, Christian Grothoff wrote:
> Hi!
> 
> I'd also like to know if either of you has done any proof-of-concept
> study to see how to get an ICMP with payload (!) past NATs.  Outgoing
> ICMP ECHO/PING requests are usually very easy.
> 
> The crux is what does it take for (a typical) NAT to let a PONG through.
>  Can we send one or more with a modified payload?  How will NATs react
> to getting multiple PONGs in "response" to a single PING? Do we need to
> make sure the responding host does not send a PONG as well (giving you 2
> replies and doubling bandwidth)?
> 
> Will NATs typically allow such "duplicates"? How many? For how long?
> How does the NAT match the PONG to the PING (especially if the payload
> doesn't match)?  Maybe a typical implementation only looks at only
> certain bits of the payload which we can fake while hiding the real
> payload in the rest?
> 
> Overall, given that we wouldn't have to deal with NAT port mapping, I
> like the idea. But given that we'd want to send a PONG with different
> payload than the PING, I worry about NATs dropping the PONGs. Or maybe
> you're thinking about other ICMP message types, but then I worry about
> where we can put how much payload per ICMP.
> 
> Regardless, if you can find some paper with a measurement study OR do
> some minimal pcap-based measurement study yourself *before* really
> starting on this, that would be important to make sure we implement an
> *effective* method.
> 
> My 2 cents
> 
> Christian
> 
> 
> On 03/19/2015 08:31 PM, DocMalloc wrote:
> > Hi!
> > 
> > My name is matthias and I am the gnunet developer with the strongest
> > focus on the transport subsystem and therefore I would be the mentor for
> > this project. I have CC'ed Christian (gnunet guru) to keep him notified
> > about your idea...
> > 
> > My first impression is useful so there is no general objection from my
> > side against this idea.
> > 
> > 1) So just as a start:
> > Do you have coding experience, in particular with C and under Linux?
> > What kind of software projects did you work before? 
> > 
> > This is just to prevent frustration ... your project would be integrated
> > in the existing transport infrastructure, so you should be experienced
> > in understanding existing code and to integrate your idea in an existing
> > project.
> > 
> > 2) Could you give me an idea how you plan to use ICMP to allow peers to
> > communicate? 
> > 
> > What is your goal and what are your assumptions about the environment?
> > How do you plan to use ICMP? 
> > How do you plan to implement it? 
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > 
> > Matthias
> > 
> > On Thu, 2015-03-19 at 12:20 -0500, Yuzhong Wen wrote:
> >> Hi all,
> >>
> >>
> >> My name is Yuzhong Wen and I’d like to participate with a project for
> >> GNUNet at Gsoc.
> >>
> >>
> >> So from the idea page I saw that GNUNet is going to implement multiple
> >> transport services support, so my idea is to build a transport service
> >> which is based on ICMP. Specifically, I want to build something like a
> >> Ping-tunnel between 2 peers. This could be useful in the situation
> >> that the firewall has blocked transport layer protocols (like a
> >> firewall blocks most of the UDP and TCP connections using a white list
> >> policy) and only allows ICMP packets to passthrough the gateway.
> >>
> >>
> >> I just submitted the proposal, however I’m not sure if this idea is
> >> viable in current GNUNet design since right now I’m still trying to
> >> understand the architecutre of GNUNet. Is there a mentor that can give
> >> me some advises on that? Thanks!
> >>
> >>
> >> Here’s the link to my proposal, should be accessable by organization
> >> members.
> >>
> >> https://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/proposal/review/student/google/gsoc2015/ywen/5629499534213120
> >>
> >>
> >> ———
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >>
> >> Wen
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> GNUnet-developers mailing list
> >> address@hidden
> >> https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnunet-developers
> > 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GNUnet-developers mailing list
> address@hidden
> https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnunet-developers

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