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From: Vorfeed Canal
Subject: Re: PHP to GUILE
Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2005 23:05:41 +0400

On 9/26/05, Zeeshan Ali <address@hidden> wrote:
> >
> > I took a look. Conclusion: it's a mess.
>  Your conclusion is based on your ignorance.
Possible. Care to enlighten men ?

> Please at least read the log yourself first, it's not (xchat-guile
> plugin-system) that guile is unable to find but the xchat's main
> module that is defined inside the xchat plugin, writen in C.
Ok. And then why your plugin-system never loaded this main module instead ?

> > And in this case it's easy to move plugin-system.scm to
> > /usr/lib/xchat/plugins (where it belongs) since guile DOES have
> > adjustable %load-path . GUILE does NOT have something similar for
> > native libraries. That's the problem.
> plugin-system is NOT an xchat plugin but a guile module that the
> xchat-guile plugin uses.

Ok. No problem. If this "is NOT an xchat plugin" but simple guile
module then it usable without xchat, right ? This means (use-modules
(xchat-guile plugin-system)) works, right ? Oops. It does not.
Conclusion: it's NOT guile module but part of xchat module. It's
written in scheme but it does not make it guile module. Just like the
fact that your is written in C does not make it C library.

> Since it's a guile module, IMHO it doesn't belong in directory for xchat 
> plugins.
But it's NOT guile module - my simple test proved it. That's the problem.

Let's take a look on lilypond:
/usr/share/lilypond/2.6.3/ps - postscript helper routines
/usr/share/lilypond/2.6.3/scm - guile modules
/usr/share/lilypond/2.6.3/tex - tex macroses

Sane ? Sane: it does not matter if it's in scheme and interpereted by
guile interpereter or in tex and interpreted by etex - if it's
unusable outside of lilypond it does not belong to /usr/share/guile
and/or /usr/share/texmf.

Now xchat and xchat-guile.
/usr/lib/xchat/plugins/ - ok, xchat<->perl glue
/usr/lib/xchat/plugins/ - xchat plugins written in perl
/usr/lib/xchat/plugins/ - ok, xchat<->guile glue
/usr/share/guile/site/xchat-guile/plugin-system.scm - WTF ?

Why the hell part of xchat<->guile glue code does in default guile
%load-path ? Is it usable outside of xchat ? If yes - then how exactly
it's usable ? If not - then why it's not in /usr/lib/xchat/plugins or
/usr/lib/xchat/guile or something like that ?

> 2. Since guile doesn't allow you to 'unplug' modules on the run, I had
> to do some trick to make it work, which makes it a bit complicated,
> but it's not a mess. :)

I was not reffering to plugin-system.scm contents but to it's place in
filesystem. It's a mess. May be it's unavoidable mess, I do not know
(I fail to see why it's unavoidable but who knows) - but it's a mess
nonetheless.Simple question: can I install two different versions of
xchar with two different versions of xchat-guile glue code ? Answer:
no - we'll get clash in
/usr/share/guile/site/xchat-guile/plugin-system.scm. And why that
happened ? Since this file does not belong to /usr/share/guile/site
directory in first place but was put there anyway.

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