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Re: code completion


From: Bastien Guerry
Subject: Re: code completion
Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 13:07:22 +0000
User-agent: Gnus/5.110007 (No Gnus v0.7) Emacs/23.0.60 (gnu/linux)

Hi Richard,

Richard G Riley <address@hidden> writes:

> It is also honest to state ones opinion as to the current state. And I
> have requoted my original statements below in case they are further
> misrepresented however unintentionally.
>
>> other editors, not because it is dishonest, but because such an advice
>> won't help make the Emacs implementation better.
>
> And neither will "come on in, it all works perfectly."

Well, I did not say that...

>> And the more constructive way is to give directions on how to help
>> improving the feature.
>
> I agree. What makes you think this has not happened? 

I'm not saying that you don't agree with the above: but your first reply
to the OP was not as helpful as the last ones, was it?

> I get the feeling you take my words as some sort of attack? They are
> not and I am mildly surprised at your reaction here. Possibly a late
> night maintaining the (excellent) org-mode? :-;

:)

Believe me, no angriness/bitterness in my reaction, and sorry if I gave
the impression that I wanted to lecture you about the good and bad ways
of answering such requests... not my style.  Sometimes my answers are
too shorts, and as english is not my first language it might sounds a
bit "rigid".

> He didn't ask about a specific tool. He asked about code
> completion. 

Well, he asked about code completion in Emacs.  He mentionned SlickEdit
and Kdevelop, so I deduced he wanted to use Emacs, not one of the many
other possibilities. 

> What is your experience of code completion? Have you used CEDET and
> ecb etc?

I tried CEDET Ecb etc. long time ago but thought it was not that
straightforward to install.  And I don't really need code completion 
as I mainly speak elisp (yes, I'm a hobbist, not a programmer.)

> As for suggesting the op switches to another tool, I would remind you of
> what I actually said (including redirecting him to the semantic mailing
> list):
>
> ,----
> | It's a commonly asked question and frequently goes without an answer. I
> | tried semantic but couldn't really get it to work. You might ask on
> | their mailing list as I think thats the only route. I have a nasty
> | feeling that using emacs as a C/C++ IDE might be coming to the end of
> | the road as it falls behind in many of the features (code completion,
> | refactoring for an example) that more modern IDEs like Eclipse
> | provides. The maintainer of ecb as good as said the same. A shame.
> `----
>
> What parts of this are wrong or misleading? 

Nothing wrong or misleading.  I just said: "depressing".

You said:

  I have a nasty feeling that using emacs as a C/C++ IDE might be coming
  to the end of the road as it falls behind in many of the features
  (code completion, refactoring for an example) that more modern IDEs
  like Eclipse provides.

So what reaction do you expect from the OP?  If I were him, I would
think of giving up Emacs for coding in C/C++.  This is what I found
depressing.  

> As i stated, the ecb developer HIMSELF has voiced his concerns at
> emacs falling behind too.

So what? 

> The bottom line is that where emacs excels in some places, it is
> lagging in others. Not all of us have the time or the ability to "do
> it ourselves" and sometimes it saves people a lot of time and hassle
> to forewarn them of possible pitfalls.

Okay, but my bottom line was that it is more helpful to give directions
on how to improve the feature (and you did somehow, telling him to ask
the question on the semantic mailing list) rather than letting him that
"emacs as a C/C++ IDE might be coming to the end of the road"...  

You don't know, maybe the itch is strong enough for him that he will try
his best to follow his direction.  If we all assume that nobody has the
time to improve the features, then maybe we should close this mailing
list?  I generally prefer to assume people at the end will be able to
help !  

> Using emacs is an obsession with some of us. 

I know what you mean!  And sometimes, just people feel ashamed of this
and they find a relief in "telling the truth" about modern editors.

Don't feel ashamed!  Don't surrender!

:)

-- 
Bastien




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