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Re: Transposed Chord name "F flat"

From: Arno Waschk
Subject: Re: Transposed Chord name "F flat"
Date: Thu, 04 Nov 2004 12:06:03 +0100
User-agent: Opera M2/7.53 (Win32, build 3850)

Beware, long post, but some on-topic remarks in the end...

On Thu, 4 Nov 2004 01:12:51 +0100 (CET), Johannes Schindelin <address@hidden> wrote:


On Wed, 3 Nov 2004, Arno Waschk wrote:

Well, it is both sure that Bach did not invent a tuning system with equal
intervals [...]

Interesting! If you have a CD recording of Bach himself, I would like to
have a copy!

As you probably know, here in Germany we have original organs from that time with original instructions how to tune them. And we have lots of writings how to tune pianos in different possible ways (Those Werckmeister things, and many others). The idea of practically using perfectly equal semitones' intervals is relatively new (end of 19th century, i think), compared to the theoretical idea (beginning of 16th century). And we know that those people preferred having different big thirds and forths on the keyboard!

And regarding certain keys having different characters than
others: everybody with absolute pitch - and even some without - will agree
that it changes the character for example of the Pathetique if you change
the key. I do not have absolute pitch, but I can tell if it is the right
key or not. That has nothing to do with temperament.

Probably not. Although i did not test that with perfectly tempered computer sounds, which you never will have on a piano (Tuners are humans). The good news is that we are all born with perfect pitch, so as babies we perfectly recognize the pitches of our mother's voice. So maybe the idea of somebody not having perfect pitch does not really exist. You might not have developped yours as far as others, but you telling the right key might be the effect of a partial perfect pitch.

I find Einstein's mathematics much more beautiful. Not that i understand
all of it...

I do understand all of Einstein's wife's mathematics (after all, it was
her doing all the tedious calculations). And there are parts which seem to
be more complicated than they should be in order to appear "beautiful".

Well, matter of taste, no? There is sorts of complications i can find beautiful personally. Not-equally tempered scales belong to them. Might be just me (and Mr. Harnoncourt...)

By the way, no piano is tuned equally temperedly.

Oh well, I'd better sue Kawai then.

No, don't. You will hate the equally temperedly piano sound. All octaves will sound too small, more or less. At least when being played simultaneously.

Alphorns are not exactly suitable to perform a thing like a subdominante,

yes they are. Just not in the lowest octave. But then, you normally do not
play the lowest octave anyway.

That alphorn music i know does not have a thing like a subdominante. Even theoretically it would be complicated to create pieces containing that.

Yodeling temperament comes from beer rather than from theoretical ideas.

Yodeling comes not from beer, believe me.

Maybe not from, but often together with...
I was not too serious about that remark, by the way.

Yodeling is out of tune by definition. I am bavarian, believe me.

I occasionally do it myself. It comes straight from the heart.

So, tell us: Is your heart equally tempered?

And it is
not at all out of tune. I am not Bavarian, but I am honoured to have
friends who can enchant me with their yodeling, and sometimes I even take
part in the whole.

"out of tune" was not meant to be "bad" at all. It is true the way it is.

If you didn't spend some hours climbing a mountain and enjoyed this
wonderful music high above the woods, echoing in perfect harmony from
mountainsides far away, you have missed something.

I did do those things. This is why i said that beer is involved more often than not.

And I agree with another poster, this discussion doesn't belong here.

Oops, that might be true.

So here is the on-topic content:

I would vote for an option lilypond enabling to produce more easily readable harmonies in addition to the nowadays behaviour, which seems to be needed, too, for a certain correctness.

Greetings, Arno


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