RE: lilypond and editors

[Rick Hansen (aka RickH)]

Kress, Stephen-2 wrote:
> 
> 
> It is true that Java is, by default, a p-code style language.  However,
> what Bertalan Fodor was referring to is what's called the "Just in Time"
> compiler.  The JIT must not be confused with Java's command line compiler. 
> The command line compiler (or those built into IDEs) convert Java text
> source code into Java byte code (or p-code, if you like).  The JIT is
> actually part of the runtime environment which, as the p-code is accessed,
> converts the p-code to native machine code.
> 
> As you might imagine, this is quite a complicated task.  So much so that
> Sun provides two different JITs, one tuned for client access (UIs and
> such) which converts p-code to native code almost immediately and one
> tuned for longer running servers, which takes a more analytical approach,
> making far better choices on machine code conversion based on usage
> patterns.  Keep in mind to that in-lining is only one of a large variety
> of optimizations the JIT employs.
> 
> Based on current benchmarks, Java software runs as fast or significantly
> faster than even hand-written C code.  Even in Java 6 (just released)
> there are some very noticeable speed improvements.  All the documentation
> about Java being slow is either very old (still touted about by
> anti-Java-ers) or the result of very poor application design and
> implementation (even the JIT can't overcome a bad programmer; the most
> typical issue being that the person using Java objects still writes their
> code very procedure-oriented, without properly switching to the object
> oriented paradigm).
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: address@hidden on
> behalf of Anthony W. Youngman
> Sent: Wed 12/13/2006 5:23 AM
> To: address@hidden
> Subject: Re: lilypond and editors
>  
> In message <address@hidden>, Bertalan Fodor 
> <address@hidden> writes
>>Certainly not. Actually the java code is compiled to machine code at 
>>runtime. This is slower than precompiling, but the compiled code can 
>>run faster than its precompiled counterpart, because the runtime 
>>machine will have information about how often a certain part of the 
>>code is called, and those calls can be made inline. Running inline code 
>>is much faster than procedure calls.
>>
>>Bert
> 
> Java code is actually a form of p-code (p standing for pseudo). 
> Pseudo-code engines CAN be blindingly fast.
> 
> There's a lot of history behind pseudo-code - like UCSD pascal for 
> example, or the example dear to me, the Pick system. At least one system 
> I ran implemented a lot of the Pick instruction code set in microcode, 
> and indeed, I understand that is the way the transputer works.
> 
> Any system with access to the first stage of a processor's pipeline and 
> the ability to redefine it (ie any decent modern processor - don't know 
> if that definition includes x86 :-) should be able to run p-code at the 
> same sort of speed as "native" code.
> 
> Cheers,
> Wol
>>
>>Erik Sandberg írta:
>>> On Saturday 09 December 2006 10:27, Bertalan Fodor wrote:
>>>
>>>> Well, what is extremely important: development time is so little in 
>>>>Java
>>>> and with JEdit (compared to any alternatives), that I won't change this
>>>> platform. The price is that it will remain slow if you don't have much
>>>> memory in the machine.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I'm not a java expert, but wouldn't it get a lot faster if you 
>>>compiled everything to native machine code (using gcj, for instance)?
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>lilypond-user mailing list
>>address@hidden
>>http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
> 
> -- 
> Anthony W. Youngman - address@hidden
> 
> 
> 
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> 2006-12-13, 05:26:57
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> 2006-12-13, 08:25:13
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I've never seen a Java application run fast on Windows, ever, in fact they
are so slow that they are unbearable to use.


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