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Re: Accidentals: Unwanted naturals

From: Jonathan Wilkes
Subject: Re: Accidentals: Unwanted naturals
Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2009 17:33:08 -0700 (PDT)

> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2009 07:21:34 -0700
> From: Kees van den Doel <address@hidden>
> Subject: Re: Accidentals: Unwanted naturals
> To: address@hidden
> Message-ID: <address@hidden>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
> >From: Kieren MacMillan <address@hidden:
> > Hi David R,
> > 
> > > AFAIK, all of the graphical-interface music
> scoring programs
> > > use the visually-oriented logic.
> > 
> > The last time I used Finale — which, thankfully, was
> a very long 
> > time  
> > ago! ;) — there were only two ways of entering
> notes:
> > 
> > 1. From a MIDI keyboard: Clearly, you can't "follow
> the 
> > key  
> > signature" with this method, since pressing a (MIDI)
> g-sharp 
> > gives a  
> > g-sharp, regardless of the key signature.
> > 2. Mouse/QWERTY keyboard ("Speedy"?) entry: When you
> clicked 
> > on  
> > (e.g.) the "g-line" of the treble clef, a g-NATURAL 
> > appeared,  
> > regardless of the key signature, and you had to scroll
> up or 
> > down (or  
> > click-add an accidental) to change the
> pitch/alteration.
> > 
> > Is that not still true? Are there any Finale or
> Sibelius users 
> > out  
> > there who can confirm what model these prorgrams use?
> Of course these programs operate as you describe. If you
> edit a piece in G major
> and enter the notes through a MIDI keyboard you have to
> play E F# G, not
> E F G, and I can't imagine an other way. Well I can, but it
> is like playing a piano with
> a "key" setting so that when you hit the F, an F# sounds if
> you set the G-major mode.
> Kees (An ex Finale user who'll never go back)

In Finale, both Speedy Entry and Simple Entry 
add notes to the staff without putting any accidentals in front of the 
note.  If you're in c-major and you enter a note on the middle line of the 
treble clef, it's a b-natural.  If you're in f-major, it's entered as a 

Handling these types of graphical entry in the same way as Lilypond would 
be peculiar, because in Finale the process is a kind of computer-assisted 
hand engraving where you put the mouse pointer on the staff and click to 
let the program "etch" the note for you.  If you were to hand engrave a 
piece in f-major and you wanted a b-flat, you would just etch the 
note-head on the middle line, so that's the metaphor for GUI entry.

In Lilypond that would be analogous to a system to specify which line, 
space, or ledger line on the staff you want the notehead to be drawn on. 
It is not, however, analogous to using the character "f" to specify 
an f-sharp in the key of d-major; from the user's point of view, Finale 
remains agnostic on what to call the note that's being entered.  If 
there were a speech-recognition plugin in Finale that would draw an 
f-sharp when "f" was spoken, I'm sure a lot of theory teachers would 
be up in arms.


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