Re: confusion in left frame of the website

[Marcus Brinkmann]

On Sat, Aug 23, 2003 at 06:28:20PM +0000, Robert Millan wrote:
> There's no link for installing the Hurd. For GNU Mach we have some notes [1]
> about build dependencies, cross-compiling, etc. But for the Hurd there are
> no such notes. What you will find in their place are notes for installing
> a Debian GNU/Hurd distribution.

Right.  Installing the Hurd itself is something that is peculiar to do.  For
example, as of today, if you install the Hurd via make install, it will
overwrite the /libexec/rc file and thus wipe out some of the Debian specific
code in it from the Debian package.

So this is something that first needs to be made to work correctly.  Until
then, installing the Hurd from the sources is only for advanced users and
developers.  I would be happy if someone would take a look at it, see what
needs to be fixed, make suggestions and then write some documentation how
the Hurd can be compiled from sources, installed, and under what
circumstances you have to reboot then.

Another thing that worries me is that there is no test suite for the Hurd. 
Installing the Hurd can make your system unbootable.  While this is also
true for the kernel, the kernel is only one file, and it is easy to keep the
old version as a backup.  For the Hurd this is near impossible, given the
fact that there are zillions of binaries and shared libraries.

> It is not common for a new user to have any interest on installing the Hurd
> though. Person would want to install a usable GNU/Hurd system instead having
> the information for installing GNU/Hurd under "the Hurd" gives the idea that
> "GNU/Hurd" and "the Hurd" are the same thing.

Ok, ok.  I am willing to have one web page "GNU/Hurd", it can even be the
first one, as a top level item above "The GNU Hurd" (or is it "The Hurd"?)
in the menu.  It can then link to various OS distributions of the GNU/Hurd,
which would be Debian GNU/Hurd for now.

If we do this, I would highly recommend that someone updates the Debian
GNU/Hurd port page for the Hurd before that.

> Correct me if i am wrong, but my impression is that most new GNU/Hurd users
> think they're installing and using "the Hurd". Whereas this is true in some
> way (just like they're installing and using "Coreutils"), it gives a wrong
> idea: that "the Hurd" and "GNU/Hurd" are actualy the same thing.

Well, I agree of course.  So here is a plan:

1. Update the Debian GNU/Hurd pages.
2. Write some install docs for the Hurd (from sources).
3. Write a GNU/Hurd page.
4. Install everything :)

I guess an alternative plan could be:

1. Write some install docs for the Hurd (from sources).
2. Write a GNU/Hurd page that is content-wise comparable to what the current
   web page has on installation of the GNU/Hurd (under The Hurd Install or
   whatever else is around)
3. Install that.

But in that latter scenario I would try to be careful to not let the
GNU/Hurd section become dominant and include all the info you would want
about Debian GNU/Hurd, for example.

How does this sound to you?

Thanks,
Marcus

-- 
`Rhubarb is no Egyptian god.' GNU      http://www.gnu.org    address@hidden
Marcus Brinkmann              The Hurd http://www.gnu.org/software/hurd/
address@hidden
http://www.marcus-brinkmann.de/