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Re: [Bug-gnuzilla] GNU LibreJS won't be removed from GNU IceCat

From: Narcis Garcia
Subject: Re: [Bug-gnuzilla] GNU LibreJS won't be removed from GNU IceCat
Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2018 17:36:45 +0100

Another (additional) idea:
FSF web search engine, running a Searx|Metager|Gigablast derived
software that {excludes|labels|de-prioritizes} websites with anti-features.

Because: If web is an application stack, websites have anti-features
same as the rest of software.

El 07/03/18 a les 20:14, Stephan Kreutzer ha escrit:
> Hi guys,
> I don't know to which extend each of you is involved in web standards -- I 
> myself only observe it passively, so feel free to object to any of my 
> following statements:
> To me, it looks like that there can't be a HTML6 any more than there was a 
> HTML4 and HTML5, because in HTML5, the crazy web guys decided that they 
> neither need a DOCTYPE any more, and the deprecated version attribute for the 
> root element was removed, so now, to my knowledge, there's no way to 
> distinguish a HTML5 document from a HTML6 document except reading the whole 
> thing and heuristically find out at the very end that it isn't the 
> version/standard your custom supports, or to find out according to which 
> Schema that document wants itself to be validated against. The idea here 
> seems to be that older clients are supposed to still be able to 
> read/interpret documents that contain elements of a newer standard, but only 
> react to those elements they support and ignore all others, at the expense of 
> never being able again to introduce new structures that conflict with the 
> older standards, as there's no secure path for safe identification and 
> conversion any more.
> Regarding the scripting and general conception, I arrived at the impression 
> that the web is more or less an application stack (forms and JS and media 
> elements and whatnot) and not for mostly static documents at all, because 
> what do you have for the latter? Headers, paragraphs, lists and only the most 
> primitive type of link, that's basically it? The initial concept and spec 
> seems to be focused on providing a mechanism to link together resources from 
> different systems in different formats in lists, so it's easier to navigate 
> them while the host system details are abstracted away by the URL [1], while 
> the CERN research data and publications themselves weren't (re)written in 
> HTML (and how could they, who would ask the world to convert all of their 
> stuff for this small Hypertext system that doesn't offer a lot for text?). 
> Later, the browser people abandoned the semantic web as there's more money in 
> e-commerce, online applications and centralized services like Google. What 
> would happen if 
>  ordinary people could run their own small clients/agents that can easily 
> work with data that's published on the web without the need to bring a big, 
> bloated browser that's able to parse whatever crap HTML might be out there 
> and tries to make something reasonable out of it? And now that effort is 
> revived under the new name "linked data", but in contrast to semantic web 
> ideas, now humans are supposed to invest their valuable lifetime to read API 
> documentation and write specific code for it.
> I might be totally wrong with my perspective, but on 2018-12-09, it'll be the 
> 50th anniversary of Doug Engelbart's Mother of All Demos, so there's a group 
> that tries to come up with something that's a better networked environment 
> than what we usually encounter today, along the lines of the early Internet 
> pioneers [2], Doug Engelbart [3], Ted Nelson [4], and I'll also add David 
> Gelernter [5]. Things are all over the place as the new system isn't there 
> yet, but
>     https://doug-50.info
> is a place to learn more about those efforts and to get involved, as I would 
> doubt as of now that "HTML6" will help with some of the problems at hand.
> Sincerely,
> Stephan Kreutzer
> [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2GylLq59rI
> [2] https://archive.org/details/ComputerNetworks_TheHeraldsOfResourceSharing
> [3] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJDv-zdhzMY, 
> https://archive.org/details/000127EngelbartColloquiumPart1 from 38:00 on, 
> https://archive.org/details/000127EngelbartColloquiumPart2 from 44:00 on, but 
> especially from 49:19
> [4] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3I54QXQPLA
> [5] 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrhM6uXMLZg&list=PLZQMfWBUelIge46VFOd53V1IhW-UzHScK
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pTEmbeENF4

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