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[Calendula-devel] Re: fundraising system -GNUe

From: Darryl Caldwell
Subject: [Calendula-devel] Re: fundraising system -GNUe
Date: 09 Sep 2003 14:27:31 -0700

Thanks, Derek.

I just took a stroll through again. I will keep
it in mind. I saw the old screenshots of the forms, etc.

If you have any links to projects with screenshots and good docs on how
people are using GNUe to develop them please pass them on.

I plan on building a fairly complex system to compete with proprietary
systems like Raiser's Edge, Donor2. I need solid tools and the ability
to customize the UI is going to be very important. 

On Tue, 2003-09-09 at 13:50, Derek Neighbors wrote:
> Darryl Caldwell said:
> > I looked at it last Fall/Winter when I was contacted by FSF.
> Ah I thought name sounded vaguely familiar.
> > I would love to discuss it with you, maybe you can put my concerns to
> > rest:
> >
> > * I found GNUe unstable.
> It gets more stable with every release.  It would be no more unstable than
> an application started from scratch.  (i.e. stability comes with time)
> > * It took a lot of work to get the system installed and running
> On a debian system or windows system install and configure time is under
> 15 minutes.  I installed on a red hat LTSP setup for a class last week in
> about 45 minutes (30 minutes downloading rpm dependencies and remembering
> how to initialize postgres on redhat) and had 30 client work stations
> working.
> > * GNUe Designer was totally unstable
> It has added a ton of features since last release.  It is still far from
> rock solid, but it doesn't lose data.
> > * Ability to customize the interface. NPO development directors like
> > pretty GUIs. I wanted the flexibility to alter it.
> Well, I think pretty GUIs are overrated to a large degree.  I think most
> users just want software that meets their needs it is the people
> "pitching" the software usually that insist on glitter widgets.  GNUe
> likely will not have emphasis any time soon on spinning throbbing glow
> widgets.
> > * I want GNU/Linux, BSD clients but I want Win/Mac clients so users can
> > ease into the transition.
> We run all platforms mentioned above, without changing a line of code in
> your application.  (Well its been a while since we toyed with Mac (and you
> had to use Fink))
> > * Documentation was scant, not much mailing list traffic, and it seemed
> > that most of the real discussion was only taking place in IRC.
> Documentation is still somewhat slim, but getting better.  Most
> conversation takes place on IRC, because that is where people want it.  If
> people were to converse on the mailing list, the developers would answer
> there.
> > * Didn't see any evidence of people doing anything really interesting
> > with it.
> We have GNUe Small Business started, a major division one univerisity
> Mathematics Department uses it for various record keeping tasks.  There
> are 4 or 5 small retail/distribution shops running it for various tasks
> (not accounting).  We have a GNUe Point of Sale system in a bookstore and
> we have a help desk application servicing one a large magazine
> fullfillment call center.
> It is just most people are using to author non free CUSTOM applications,
> so really don't want to be blabbing to their competition about what they
> are using to solve their problems.
> > Then I found GnuMed ( Have you looked at their
> > work? It is a work of art...straight wxpython and PostgreSQL.
> It is decent.  Remember GNUe is a framework to rapidly build and extend
> applications.  Something like GNUMed is extremely rigid and takes
> exhorbant work to add new features, much like GNUCash and other
> non-framework built applications.
> > The Chandler folks are also working with wxPython.
> > I figure it would be
> > good to interoperate with them down the line.
> wxPython is a decent toolkit.  It has problems here and there, but its
> probably the best cross platform tool there now.
> > And to top it off wxGlade is an awesome gui designer:
> >
> > Your thoughts?
> Yeah you can prototype screens really quickly with Glade, but getting a
> database driven application is a totally different story.  To me GNUe's
> designer is just as easy as Glade if not more so and it automatically
> binds all of the widgets to datasources and I don't have to write a line
> of code to read, write and query data from a database.
> Certainly every person has own opinion and own style.  So I am not
> criticizing or knocking somethign like wxGlade or using native wxPython. 
> I just generally people balk at GNUe because there is a small (yet
> existing) curve involved in installing, configuring and understanding the
> framework.  I equate it much to Debian.  People generally hate debian,
> cause they can not install it or get X configured.  However, as soon as
> they get past that hump and get the power of apt-get and config files in
> Debian they refuse to go back.  I just ask that you don't sell yourself
> short cause you have trouble configuring X (so to speak). :)
> -Derek
Darryl Caldwell address@hidden
Fudo Systems
206/567-5802  "Free Your Computers!"

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