Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] TI vs Freescale DSP for open-source development

[Almohanad Fayez]

okay here are my 2 cents

2- TI actually offers all the tools you need to develop for their DSP for free, I can vouch for the C64x+ DSP since that's what I have experience using.  You can download and look at the supported DSP for the free download from
http://software-dl.ti.com/dsps/dsps_registered_sw/sdo_sb/targetcontent/

The biggest issue you might run into with the free software is the ability to use a JTAG, if you want to use a JTAG you have to use Code Composer period.  Though I've read about people using the free demo version of Code Composer (CCS) 4.0 with a very cheap JTAG ( < $150) to debug their DSP code.  I think TI restricts the type of DSPs and JTAGs you can use with the free CCS I know that the JTAG I use (XDS560) is not supported.

3- TI support for open source is surprisingly decent.  I've posted many questions on their support forums and TI engineers have always gotten back to me with alot of good information and continued asnwering as posted more follow up questions.

4- The learning tool has a bit of a learning curve that's for sure.  I have posted a github link on the listserv yesterday which includes new custom blocks for GNU Radio using the C64x+ DSP.  You might find the guide helpful in shedding some light about developing with TI tools.

6- I've been using TI software as an open source developer for almost 1.5 years now and I think they've managed to find a great balance between being a for profit company and a supplier of tools for the open source community.  I don't have experience with freescale but my experience with TI has been a positive one.


al fayez

-----Original Message-----
From: Alexander Chemeris <address@hidden>
To: Gnuradio-discuss <address@hidden>
Sent: Fri, Jan 28, 2011 10:24 am
Subject: [Discuss-gnuradio] TI vs Freescale DSP for open-source development

Hello all,



We're working on an open-source WiMAX receiver/scanner and we're

looking into using a high-performance DSP to process data from USRP.

Right now we implement this processing in FPGA, but we want to

experiment with DSPs too. I know there are skilled people here and I'm

looking forward to hear their opinion.



Note, that this project is not meant for starving students or

occasional hobbyists. It is for high-profile hobbyists, targeted

researchers and for small companies. So please refrain from comments

like "no way, this is too expensive for 90% of community". Though we

would appreciate comments on how to make it cheaper.



So, I'm looking for the community advise about pros and cons of

different DSPs. Particularly I'm interested in comparing Freescale

MSC815x/MSC825x [1][2][3] and TI TMS320C667x [4][5] DSPs/SoCs from the

perspective of open-source development. But if you know any other good

 high-profile DSPs - please propose them too. So far, as I read it we

have following comparison:



1) Price.

It used to be that Freescale is cheaper, but right now I see that

"pricing for the MSC8156 starts at $192 in 10,000 unit quantities"

[6], while TMX320C6670CYP is priced 160.00 USD | 1ku [7]. So they're

barely the same with TI slightly winning. I'm not sure how much will

new MSC8157 cost.



2) Development tools price

Both Freescale CodeWarrior and TI Code Composer seem to be at the same

line with about $2K per single license (correct me if I'm wrong - I

may have missed something easily).



Big minus here is that neither Freescale nor TI offer open/free

compilers for their DSPs, which is a big roadblock for open-source

development.



3) Support for open-source technologies.

Well, both Freescale and TI declare themselves as more or less

open-source supporters (which is weird while they have expensive

development tools). Both offers BSPs for Linux for GPP part of SoCs

and free/open OSes for DSP cores (SmartDSP for Freescale, SYS/BIOS for

TI). I would appreciate if someone could comment on maturity of those

and their usability (bug-ness level).



Other then that I don't see any evidence of their support for

open-source for their DSPs.



4) Quality/simplicity

I have no experience with those DSPs yet, so I would very much

appreciate comments about development tools quality / easy to use,

code generation quality, DSP architecture simplicity for a programmer

and (important!) documentation quality.



5) Chips availability

I'm a software guy, so again I seek for an insight about availability

of Freescale and TI DSPs. How hard is it to source them? Especially

outside of US?



6) Any other concerns?

Please share your opinion - I should have missed something important.

It's hard to keep everything in mind.



PS As I told, we're working on an open-source WiMAX receiver right

now. If you're a skilled engineer and you're willing to participate -

drop me a few lines with your experience description. We need more

skilled hands to get up and running faster. And I should say this

project is a *lot* of fun.

PPS Please don't mail me if you just want to look into the code out of

curiosity or don't have enough skills or enough time to help. We'll

announce the project publicly when we have a (somehow) working

prototype. Right now we just have a bunch of Matlab proof-of-concept

code and we've started to port it to FPGA.



Thank you if you get that far! Sorry for the long e-mail :)



1. http://www.freescale.com/webapp/sps/site/homepage.jsp?code=STARCORE_HOME

2. http://www.bdti.com/InsideDSP/2010/12/16/Freescale

3. http://www.bdti.com/InsideDSP/2010/05/20/Freescale

4. http://focus.ti.com/dsp/docs/dspcontent.tsp?contentId=77428&DCMP=nysh_101109&HQS=Other+PR+c66multicore-tcipr-lp

5. http://www.bdti.com/InsideDSP/2010/11/18/Ti

6. http://www.eetimes.com/electronics-products/processors/4108765/Freescale-reboots-base-station-DSPs-leapfrogs-TI

7. http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tms320c6670.html



-- 

Regards,

Alexander Chemeris.

http://www.fairwaves.ru



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