Re: Donations

[Quentin Mathé]

Le 30 janv. 05, à 13:48, Lars Sonchocky-Helldorf a écrit :

> Am Sonntag, 30.01.05 um 12:57 Uhr schrieb Quentin Mathé:
>
> >  because such icons set involves a lot of work and no icon designers  
> > will subscribe to it if he is not sure to get paid.
>
> I don't believe that. Ever googled for  
> http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=free+icon+set ? Or have a  
> look at those theme sites like http://www.resexcellence.com/themes/ ?  
> Most of the themes are downloadable for free. I don't see where  
> somebody here did not work without a paycheck.

Yes I have visited such web sites many times.
I was thinking that myself too ;-)… but I needed to get back in the  
reality when I asked to more than 15 icons designers (much of them have  
created such freely usable icons themes on their free time but they  
wasn't seeing real interests in GNUstep… I have been disappointed too I  
admit.).

> > I'm saying that because it took me lot of time to find an icon  
> > designer who accepts to work for us even with his work remunerated…
>
> I would say you didn't try hard enough.

You shouldn't ;-). I really tried hard.

> I - for instance - wasn't aware that you were looking for designers.  
> And I am a person that is somewhat involved with gnustep. I did not  
> see any announce at our web site and so on.

We bring the subject various times on -discuss in September, October  
2004 for examples. We asked for UI guidelines reviews on this list  
several times too, and our icons project has been advertised on  
gnustep.org front page… hmm. You are a bit late now we started  
everything and worked hard on it. :-/

Examples :

gnustep.org :   •       Oct 27:  Donate to the  GNUstep Icon Fund.

http://www.gnustep.org/newiconcampaign/

http://groups.google.fr/groups?hl=fr&lr=&threadm=witness 
-1DED72.14301421082004%40news.t-online.com&rnum=2&prev=/ 
groups%3Fq%3Dicon%2Bgnustep%26hl%3Dfr%26lr%3D%26selm%3Dwitness 
-1DED72.14301421082004%2540news.t-online.com%26rnum%3D2

http://groups.google.fr/groups? 
hl=fr&lr=&threadm=mailman.4879.1098560764.2017.discuss- 
gnustep%40gnu.org&rnum=1&prev=/ 
groups%3Fq%3Dicon%2Bgnustep%26hl%3Dfr%26lr%3D%26selm%3Dmailman.4879.1098 
560764.2017.discuss-gnustep%2540gnu.org%26rnum%3D1

http://www.quentinmathe.com/gnustep/documentation/UI/icons/

> >  Really good icon designers have no problems to find more remunerated  
> > projects than they could manage, and moreover for icon designers the  
> > current look of GNUstep doesn't look really exciting in my opinion,  
> > this point could explain the difficulty I encountered to find one who  
> > accepts to work for us.
>
> That's why the contest. We need more publicity. And: all public  
> projects - even government ones - use the practice of open competitive  
> bidding or tender offers before giving the contract to someone.

How can you compare GNUstep to a government… ? ;-) I'm not sure it is  
the right comparison. You are overestimating the current interest for  
GNUstep outside of here I think.
It is a bit the egg and chicken problem, we need a better look to have  
more interest from the outside crowd, but we need someone in the  
outside crowd to work on a better look. The option 2 is the unrealistic  
currently from my experience…
The problem with a contest currently is the only entries will probably  
not really good because the best icon designers won't participate to  
the contest, and finally we will spend money to pay for a poor work  
when we could have a really good one (taking in account the fact no  
icons set won't be satisfactory for everyone).

> Otherwise a bad aftertaste might result: What if the contractor is a  
> personal protege of the project leader. I am not saying that your  
> designer is your pal for whom you'd like to provide some sort of easy  
> money making - but the impression could arise.

True, but nobody started to work on new icons for GNUstep, and we  
decided to do it that and asked for input and explained our proposal  
and our position, then it isn't really fair to have a bunch of late  
objections every time someone is trying to improve something…

> Even if the designer is saying: "I am not taking part in a  
> competition" that is no good sign: if he/she is the best and it is  
> under his/her level to take part in a competition why so? If you're so  
> great you'll easily being the winner - if not you weren't so great  
> obviously.

You know perfectly well I'm sure the best and the smartest people are  
rarely the winners in everyday life… GNUstep is a perfect example of  
this fact.

> And: When we a starting something big with pomp and circumstance I  
> tell you a lot more people are willing to take part (a lot more of  
> that who denied when asked in private email) We only need the right  
> appearance.

I don't think so in the current GNUstep state… (taking in account the  
current look especially, I'm not saying it should change but it is  
problematic from a marketing point of view).

Quentin.

--
Quentin Mathé
qmathe@club-internet.fr