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Re: A Critique: Getting Started with GNUstep on Windows

From: Doc O'Leary
Subject: Re: A Critique: Getting Started with GNUstep on Windows
Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2016 19:00:40 -0000 (UTC)
User-agent: com.subsume.NNTP/1.0.0

For your reference, records indicate that 
Riccardo Mottola <address@hidden> wrote:

> Doc O'Leary wrote:
> > Wrong kind of vision.  I’ve always been talking about a vision for how
> > *actual* people would find GNUstep useful.  Last time this topic came
> > up, it involved iOS, because that was the biggest community that was hot
> > on ObjC/Cocoa.  Now that Apple is pushing Swift, the stated vision either
> > has to involve that, or be very specific about *not* involving that.
> your opinion.

Don’t know what else it could be.  But it strains the credibility of the
project to pretend that Apple is not the biggest factor that impacts

> Those users however are not coders, just users.

Wrong attitude.  There is no “just” to being a user.  Every coder is
themselves a user.  My point remains that people need to be told how
GNUstep is going to be useful to them.  If the purpose is not to bring
iOS/Mac apps to non-Apple platforms, or to write open source apps that
easily run on Apple platforms, what is the value?

> Go around, ask... and you will discover that few do bother. Most mac 
> developers are fine with Mac.

Because nobody currently involved with GNUstep apparently wants to make
the case for them to *not* be fine with just the Mac.

> Others have stuff which is sheer unportable.

Possibly true for software that has heavy dependencies on Apple APIs
that GNUstep doesn’t have the resources to reimplement.  But where is
the accounting of this outreach and the dependencies that are
unsupported?  If you want to get people contributing code, you have
to let them know that Adobe says they could get Photoshop running on
Linux if they had solid ports of frameworks X, Y, and Z (or whatever).

> Otheriwse, we spend our efforts in developing a tool which is useful for 
> somebody else, but not fun for us.

Wrong attitude again.  I’d much rather put my time into supporting a
framework that is useful to dozens of apps that I didn’t have to write
myself, compared to trying to implement all those apps from scratch.
GNUstep will remain stagnant as long as your efforts are misplaced.

"Also . . . I can kill you with my brain."
River Tam, Trash, Firefly

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