Re: Boiling the Oceans [was Re: GNUstep Live on OSnews]

[Steven R. Baker]

On 31/07/17 09:48 PM, Riccardo Mottola wrote:

> Hi,
>
>
> On 31/07/2017 20:01, Steven R. Baker wrote:
> > My computing needs are simple: I need a mail client, a calendar, an 
> > address book, a web browser, and emacs. I need a few other things, 
> > but I'll make those myself. The basics are listed here. GNUstep 
> > already has excellent options for each of those categories, except a 
> > web browser. But here's the funny thing: none of the other 
> > environments have a web browser choice that's a compelling choice 
> > over Firefox anyhow.
>
> Exactly, at the end you have "something" + Firefox anyway. Sadly 
> firefox is moving to a quite ugly UI without menus, preferences inside 
> panes.. so it is "alien" everywhere. Quite different e.g. from 
> SeaMonkey which as a much more classic and enjoyable interface.
> For the rest, GS apps on my ThinkPad(s) too.

Firefox's UI is highly configurable, so I think it can be made to look 
"close enough". But you're right, Firefox looking firefox-y means it 
won't be a stumbling block for people. We can ignore the web browser 
issue now, and maybe in the future get a new WebKit port.

> > There are a few necessities that are missing before I can claim 
> > "complete desktop experience", and a lot of these things were 
> > mentioned in the LiveCD comments thread. The first thing I noticed 
> > when I set up my ThinkPad with WindowMaker + GNUstep is that the 
> > media keys don't work. It's an easy fix, and I'll do that.
>
> Some of those Keys are actually not GS, but go through X11 directly, 
> right?
> What kind of keyboard layout do you have on your TP?

I don't know; I haven't looked in detail. I *think* the right thing, 
these days, is to use libinput, and as I recall that's what Xfce does.

I have several ThinkPads. X250s with US layout (I'll switch this if I 
get a chance), W550s with Swedish layout, X1 Carbon Swedish, and X60t 
with US (but I'm about to eBay a Swedish keyboard for it.)

> > We need a few more preferences panes for configuring PulseAudio 
> > input/output options, a small app for talking to NetworkManager for 
> > configuring wifi, etc. After that, it's a matter of shipping a sane 
> > "default configuration", much like Betrand describes. There are some 
> > other things that David mentioned in a few mails, but it mostly boils 
> > down to "make sure things implement the freedesktop specifications."
>
> Yep, we all need work there, sadly, a lot of this is highly unportable 
> between OSs and also needs privilege escalation stuff... so I never 
> started working on that.

PulseAudio is pretty ubiquitous these days, so a PA-coupled Sound Prefs 
app would be reasonable. Wifi is a different ball of wax entirely, but I 
think the hard work there is in getting the UI right, and we could write 
very thin integrations. Starting with network manager, I'm sure.

> > 2) a personal finance application for budgeting, and a GTD 
> > application, both with the goal of also being available on Windows 
> > and Mac from the same codebase. I'd like for these applications to be 
> > examples of how you can do cross platform really well using GNUstep.
>
> That's a new project. Good luck.

The thing I love about *step development is that once I know what the 
app looks like, the matter of code is fairly simple.

> > 4) obviously, fixing bugs as I find them in these two previous 
> > activities.
>
> This is a precious things: it improves the whole landscae.

Graham has been my go-to (via IM) when I hit snags. Where is a better 
place to send problems as I have them? I really want to see fixes all 
the way through.

> > There are currently a few barriers to me making really good progress 
> > on this:
> >
> > 1) HiDPI not being fully baked is causing me a lot of usability 
> > problems, so I wind up working on my older systems. Which I don't 
> > always have nearby. I would *really* like to help with this, but a 
> > lot of it is way out of my depth. If someone who has the right 
> > knowledge would like to discuss this with me and help me get a better 
> > understanding, I'd love to take it on.
>
> Better Hi-Res support is needed also when running on Windows and it 
> limits quite a bit the usefulness of GS apps on modern Win8 and Win10 
> install which usually render UI elements at a scaled percentage.
> However, work on your issue in Terminal is ongoing.

Do you have a good overall idea of the bits, and what work needs to be 
done? As I said, I'm happy to take on some of the responsibility for the 
actual implementation, but I really need some help understanding the 
problem first.

> Let's hack! (or continue to..)

Cheers!

-Steven

> Riccardo
>
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