[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]
Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system
James Michael DuPont
Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system
Tue, 25 Mar 2003 13:35:11 -0800 (PST)
My critique of the information politic of free software is not
specific to dotgnu. The GCC is a perfect example of a project that
falls under the two class model.
Again, I am not getting personal here, there are problems with the
policies of free software coming from the very top.
I am pointing out the lack of open interfaces, the hiding of classes in
source files, the discouragement of meta-information.
All of these are indication of a InformationsPolitik that I find in
free software. That is the problem that I see with free software, and
it is what will hold back development unless addressed.
The point is that a Discovery service for free software needs to be
thought through carefully.
We need to consider the possibility of opening up a large amount of
metadata to the discovery service. This would conflict directly with
the current InformationsPolitik of dotgnu.
As I said, it is my challenge to you and the other dotgnu people to
deal with the question of openness and informationsharing.
It is very embarrassing that a organisation that is sworn to openness
and freedom is bent on crushing projects and hiding important internal
information from the "second class".
I am working on my patches, and will be fixing these problems as I see
them. People who also see the problem can use my patches. They will be
submitted to savannah.
--- Norbert Bollow <address@hidden> wrote:
> I think you're totally off-track with this criticism of DotGNU,
> and of Rhys in particular. (Even if you don't mention him by name,
> it's clear who you mean). The pnet project is not primarily about
> creativity, it has other goals... don't judge Rhys as being someone
> who "lacks creativity" just because he does not want your style of
> creativity in the official pnet sources. DotGNU has plenty of room
> for creativity that can be introduced in other official development
> projects, as well as in the form of inofficial patches. I can
> understand that the "cathedral" development style (which Rhys has
> consciously chosen to adopt for dotgnu-pnet) strikes you as a matter
> of "total control over the project"... I agree that a free software
> project which is developed in "cathedral" manner is like a little
> kingdom, but I think this is no problem whatsoever as long as
> everyone who wants can get their own little kingdom by forking the
> project. I think that while the arguments against forking projects
> have merit in the context of "bazaar" style projects, it's totally
> acceptable to create a fork of a "cathedral" style project, if you
> don't agree with the maintainer's choice of goals which result in
> your patches being rejected. However _because_ forking (or, what
> in this situation would be the more reasonable approach, distributing
> and maintaining an unofficial patch), is considered acceptable in the
> DotGNU community, I think you should be able to live with the fact
> that DotGNU development projects have the freedom to adopt a
> "cathedral" development style if they so choose.
> If what I'm trying to say doesn't seem to make sense to you, maybe
> we should talk about it via irc or telephone? I'd really like to
> get this situation of tension resolved, so that I can then move
> forward in the matter of official endorsement for SwigSharp.
> Wram greetings,
> James Michael DuPont <address@hidden> wrote:
> > This ties back into my original proposal for a meta-object
> > and meta-data repository.
> > http://wiki.dotgnu.org/TaskMetaDataRepository
> > That would provide many datasources for a generic discovery system.
> > We need to really ask ourselves what is going to be published and
> > not!
> > I feel that free software should not be afraid to allow free access
> > the meta-data of a program.
> > It seems that some people wish to reduce the amount of meta-data
> > available to to public, because they are afraid that they will lose
> > control of their projects when it becomes easy to change and use
> > I have no sympathy for the position of reducing knowledge and
> > information in free software project. Free software needs to be
> > and the meta data has to be made available in an easy to use
> > Discovery systems are fine for close source components, where the
> > vendor can put the goods in a black box.
> > Many free software developers lack the creativity to think
> > out of the box.
> > They are happy to copy the ideas of microsoft and present solutions
> > free software that do not make sense.
> > The idea of discovery needs to go down to the method and variable
> > where you can browse an program and extract just the needed bits
> > bobs. In the end, this is tied closely into the job of the
> > but is implemented on a global scale.
> > I challenge you to have the courage to embrace such an idea.
> > I don't think it is possible because of the lack of knowledge
> > and openness.
> > As far as I see is a clear creation of classes of developers in
> > project : the "Haves", a few who jealously hide knowledge about the
> > project and the "Have-Nots". those who are on the outside looking
> > fighting with hidden data structures, bad error messages, and FUD.
> > I challenge you all to start sharing information, even if it would
> > reduce your total control over the project, in the end the whole
> > project will gain from it.
> > mike
> > --- Norbert Bollow <address@hidden> wrote:
> > > > Unless any objections are raised soon, DotGNU will have an RDF
> > > based
> > > > discovery system.
> > >
> > > BTW there is no reason to limit this to webservices. RDF-based
> > > discovery will be useful for locating all kinds of services,
> > > including commercial services of all kinds, and including servers
> > > that
> > > offer software for download.
> > >
> > > Greetings, Norbert.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Founder & Steering Committee member of
> > > http://gnu.org/projects/dotgnu/
> > > Free Software Business Strategy Guide --->
> > > http://FreeStrategy.info
> > > Norbert Bollow, Weidlistr.18, CH-8624 Gruet (near Zurich,
> > > Switzerland)
> > > Tel +41 1 972 20 59 Fax +41 1 972 20 69
> > > http://norbert.ch
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Developers mailing list
> > > address@hidden
> > > http://www.dotgnu.org/mailman/listinfo/developers
> > =====
> > James Michael DuPont
> > http://introspector.sourceforge.net/
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your
> > http://platinum.yahoo.com
James Michael DuPont
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
Re: [DotGNU]Summary of irc meetings of Sat, 22 Mar 2003, CH Gowri Kumar, 2003/03/25
- [DotGNU]Summary of irc meetings of Sat, 22 Mar 2003, Norbert Bollow, 2003/03/25
- [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, Norbert Bollow, 2003/03/25
- Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, James Michael DuPont, 2003/03/25
- Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, Norbert Bollow, 2003/03/25
- Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system,
James Michael DuPont <=
- Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, Norbert Bollow, 2003/03/26
- Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, James Michael DuPont, 2003/03/29
- RE: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, Danny Ayers, 2003/03/29
- Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, Norbert Bollow, 2003/03/29
- Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, Rhys Weatherley, 2003/03/25
- Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, Peter Minten, 2003/03/26
- Re: [DotGNU]RDF based discovery system, James Michael DuPont, 2003/03/31