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Re: Questioning the new behavior of `open-line'.

From: Eli Zaretskii
Subject: Re: Questioning the new behavior of `open-line'.
Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2015 22:11:19 +0200

> From: Karl Fogel <address@hidden>
> Cc: address@hidden,  address@hidden
> Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2015 13:39:11 -0600
> John Wiegley <address@hidden> writes:
> > Eli Zaretskii <address@hidden> writes:
> >> People who don't like electric-indent-mode can just turn it off, can't 
> >> they?
> >> Why argue about defaults when they can be so easily changed?
> >
> >This is more about people who want to use electric-indent-mode, but don't 
> >want
> >it changing previous defaults in a way that doesn't seem to be related to
> >electric-indent-mode.
> >
> >I can imagine a new user experiencing this and having no clue that
> >electric-indent-mode is the reason: Because it is enabled by default for them
> >in 25.1 -- they never consciously turned it on to notice the difference in
> >behavior -- so they wouldn't know it's coming from that source.
> That's exactly what happened to me, yes.
> >Why is something like this being enabled by default, again? Or did I misread?
> >I would expect any kind of automated behavior like this to be opt-in.
> You didn't misread -- the new behavior is (currently) the default.  I'm 
> proposing we revert to the old behavior.

Which old behavior?  The old behavior was that electric-indent-mode
was not turned on by default.  Is that what you mean?

> Even people who use electric indent all the time would probably be surprised 
> by the new default behavior.  And there's no real advantage to this new 
> default, since one can achieve the same effect just by putting point in 
> column 0 before running `open-line'.
> So Eli, I think what John said is right: this isn't about 
> `electric-indent-mode'.  It's about `open-line', and a new behavior of 
> `open-line' that isn't what most users would expect even if they are 
> conscious of & like `electric-indent-mode'.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I think this behavior doesn't happen
when electric-indent-mode is off, which it was in previous versions of
Emacs.  Isn't that true?

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