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Re: [Gnumed-devel] Comments on 0.2.......................

From: Syan Tan
Subject: Re: [Gnumed-devel] Comments on 0.2.......................
Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2006 20:53:59 +0800

in defense of gnumed, I would like to say that it is no where near as bad as Richard makes it out to be.

I have seen intrahealth in operation at an expo some years ago, and I can't say I see that it is that similiar

to Richard's design .   But he does have a good point , in that the user interface is very important :

recently I read a newsletter about someone doing a holiday locum in Ireland, and his comment was that

the electronic medical record applications he encountered were nowhere near as good as in Australia.

I imagined him looking at an archaic dos based character input screen frontending a  something like VISTA,

and comparing it to the finely tuned rapid input , user written interface of our most widely spread emr in

australia, which frontends a dbase IV  database running on a server coordinating via file locks and with

no transactional  integrity mechanisms whatsoever.   His main point , I suppose which is true currently,

is that if your user interface is good , you could have monkeys running between file cabinets as a backend

and people will still use it and be hooked.

On Mon Jun 19 10:45 , Richard Terry sent:

Ok, Deep breath....... and a big sigh...........

What I did
Simple (non torture) test ie attempted to put in new patient, add clinical
notes etc.

Not saving basic demographic information properly
Not saving the medical record properly
etc etc etc.

No, impossible to give specifics, too many things go wrong.

I've said this before and I'll say it again.
There is something fundamentally wrong with the way you are approaching the
writing of gnuMed and the paradigm of medical records you are attempting to

Even given I disagree with your designs, there can be no excuse for the errors
in this. I've said this time and time again - you should iron the bugs out of
your data entry and saving. Even if they don't function well they should at
least work. This program locks up time and time again and needs the
Ctl_Alt_Backspace skull and crossbones to put it out of its misery.

Adding clinical data dosn't 'stick' on many occasions - ie one puts it in and
it dosn't appear back in the database to be displayed.

I can hear Karsten/Sebastian once again saying 'put your money where your
mouth is, be specific'.

Karsten it is too overwhelmingly bad to be able to know where to start.
I know all too well from my programming experience that given the way you are
putting this together, it is near nigh impossible to give you descriptions of
what I do to crash the program. You just have not covered the basic's of data
entry to catch basic errors.

I think your paradigm is wrong wrong wrong. I handed you a medical record
design on a platter - complete with 10 years of functionality built into it
and I still cannot for the life of me understand why you won't use it.

You need a 'top down' approach, not a 'bottom up' 'bolt together' approach.
Make the gui, make it function (with no data save), then add data entry and
save per section and you eventually end up with a fully functional program.

I personally don't think gnumed will ever get to a point of usability if you
continue down the trail you are going at. People with abilities come/go, as
they sense that contribution is pointless.

I will make my offer to you again Karsten.

If you want to stop in your tracks, adopt my functionality paradigm, and start
putting things together bit by bit under my direction, I will re-join the

Regards, and contrary to what you may think, best wishes on your continued



(BTW if you are interested - take a look at

A highly successful NZ company who are supplying software in AU, Canada,
Antarctica and NZ.

I encountered this program during a software evaulation with Hunter Urban
Divison did at the end of 2005/start 2006. Of interest is that their design
paradigm and my own are uncannily similar, albeit theirs is quite messy. I've
put a copy on my machine, and I think unfortunately for all the good
features, their product is quite unusable in general practice.

We panned their script writing. Of interest they are flying a systems analyst
out here to Newcastle in July to spend the afternoon with Myself and a
coleague in an attempt by them to fix that part of their product.)

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