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[GNUnet-developers] Re: GNUnet-developers Digest, Vol 17, Issue 1


From: OZGUR TAS
Subject: [GNUnet-developers] Re: GNUnet-developers Digest, Vol 17, Issue 1
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 2004 23:04:10 +0300

hello,
thank you for coding...

Ozgur KARATAS
Is.NET

----- Original Message -----
Kimden: address@hidden
Tarih: Persembe, Nisan 1, 2004 9:03 pm
Konu: GNUnet-developers Digest, Vol 17, Issue 1

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> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1. Re: Miscellaneous Ideas (Ian Clarke)
>   2. Re: libextractor, macos x (Filip Pizlo)
>   3. Re: Miscellaneous Ideas (Igor Wronsky)
>   4. Re: Miscellaneous Ideas (Ian Clarke)
>   5. GNUnet 0.6.1d released (Christian Grothoff)
>   6. Freeway Plugin for XNap (Steffen Pingel)
>   7. Re: Freeway Plugin for XNap (Christian Grothoff)
>   8. Large disk quota (Jussi Eloranta)
>   9. Re: Large disk quota (Christian Grothoff)
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 09:33:50 +0100
> From: Ian Clarke <address@hidden>
> Subject: Re: [GNUnet-developers] Miscellaneous Ideas
> To: Igor Wronsky <address@hidden>
> Cc: address@hidden, Christian Grothoff
>       <address@hidden>
> Message-ID: <address@hidden>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> On Sun, 2004-03-28 at 19:47, Igor Wronsky wrote:
> > I understand that both of you somewhat identify with the
> > aforementioned technologies,
> 
> That fact that we identify with these technologies is not an 
> excuse to
> dismiss our opinions.  I gave some concrete benefits of GNUnet and
> Freenet over BitTorrent, to which you have failed to respond.
> 
> If you aren't going to do me the courtesy of responding to my 
> comments,I see little reason to respond to yours (particularly 
> since they are
> simply a restatement of your subjective opinions).
> 
> Ian.
> 
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> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 03:51:37 -0500 (EST)
> From: Filip Pizlo <address@hidden>
> Subject: Re: [GNUnet-developers] libextractor, macos x
> To: Christian Grothoff <address@hidden>
> Cc: address@hidden, address@hidden
> Message-ID:
>       <Pine.LNX.4.21.0403150347070.5717-
address@hidden>
> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> 
> > > 2. On MacOS X (10.3.2 with gcc-3.3 from apple) the existing 
> config stuf
> > > for extractor 0.2.6 did not
> > > work for me. I had to modify the configure.ac file as follows:
> 
> In what way did it not work?
> 
> > > case "$host_os" in
> > > darwin*)
> > > #    AM_CONDITIONAL(DARWIN_LIBTOOL_BROKEN,true)
> > > #    AC_DEFINE([USE_NS_MODULE],1,[Determines if we should use the
> > > NSModule API for dynamic loading])
> > >      AM_CONDITIONAL(DARWIN_LIBTOOL_BROKEN,false)
> > >      LIBLTDL=/sw/lib/libltdl.a
> > >      LTDLINCL=-I/sw/include
> > >      ;;
> > >
> > > [This requires libtool stuff installed under /sw, which is the 
> default> > if one is
> > > using Fink] Also maybe one should add a switch to configure 
> which would
> > > allow
> > > specification of libltdtl?
> > 
> > I'm not sure if hardwireing /sw is a good thing.  I'm not 
> familiar with OSX, 
> > so I've cc'ed this to Filip Pizlo who did the OSX port.  I'd 
> suggest you 
> > discuss the matter with him to find out what is the correct 
> approach.
> 10.3.2 supports the dlopen APIs.  I see three options: 1) make the
> NSModule API support work under 10.3.2 (which should be easy); 2) use
> dlopen directly; and 3) fix ltdl to use dlopen on Mac OS X 10.3.2.
> 
> I'll try to reproduce it tomorrow on my 10.3 box.  But if you 
> could send
> me any sort of info about what exactly failed, that would be greap.
> 
> --
> Filip Pizlo
> http://bocks.psych.purdue.edu/
> address@hidden
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:42:39 +0300 (EEST)
> From: Igor Wronsky <address@hidden>
> Subject: Re: [GNUnet-developers] Miscellaneous Ideas
> To: Ian Clarke <address@hidden>
> Cc: address@hidden
> Message-ID: <address@hidden>
> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> 
> On Sun, 28 Mar 2004, Ian Clarke wrote:
> 
> > > On a gut feeling, if we gave +/- or nothing for efficiency,
> > > I'd say it would go something like
> > > +bittorrent
> > > +edonkey variants
> > > (the rest somewhere in the middle)
> > > -gnunet
> > > -freenet
> > > For example, if someone is wishing to share some of their
> > > own products with only low bandwidth available, BitTorrent
> > > is _definitely_ the choice.
> > That depends on your definition of "efficiency", but for most 
> reasonable> definitions I can think of, I think you have it 
backwards.
> 
> Ok, to do you the due courtesy, and in the light of
> 
> "I gave some concrete benefits of GNUnet and Freenet over
> BitTorrent, to which you have failed to respond."
> 
> lets analyze your message again.
> 
> > For example, with Freenet, when you publish content, you only 
> need to
> > upload the file you want to publish once (together with some check
> > blocks for FEC).  With BitTorrent, you must distribute it from a 
> central> server, and it might be downloaded many times over from 
> that server
> > until there are enough people out there sharing the file.  In most
> > cases, BitTorrent will require orders of magnitude more of the
> > publisher's upstream bandwidth than Freenet would.
> 
> So which part of this is a concrete benefit of e.g. GNUnet
> over BT? None, because there is no such thing in GNUnet as
> non-local insert. You have to stick around and contribute
> bandwidth, and you'll never know when is enough, when you
> can leave. The Freenet part I already acknowledged by saying
> that you can't generally rely on pushed content staying
> in the net.
> 
> > Personally, I don't find BitTorrent to be a particularly 
interesting
> > technology.  It is even more centralized than Napster, offers no
> > anonymity, and publishers must set up and run BitTorrent 
> trackers for
> > the entire duration of their content's availability.
> 
> These also I did acknowledge by simply making the statement
> that _supposing_ the user does not need anonymity
> or censorship resistance (for many, this equals no need
> to avoid centralization), then how do the things stand?
> 
> Even at the risk of again merely restating my subjective
> opinion, I'd like to go through that 'most reasonable
> definitions that you can think of' part again, so that
> after this, you could think of one more - the one that
> apparently very many people think of these days.
> 
> Suppose Jack wants to share a big file. Say, a 600 megabyte
> file. He has 5kbps upstream that he can sacrifice 24h
> for this purpose. Suppose there are k different Charlies
> each day, some drop off while new ones arrive, and
> they all jolly well wish to download the file, and
> eventually get off.
> 
> Now would Jack go for Freenet or GNUnet? I don't think
> he should. He should be using BT, because that can pull it
> off. People using BT successfully to download and provide
> large-size content with small resources proves the point
> empirically. If you are not aware that this has been
> happening, or where, you've been sleeping at the wheel.
> 
> So I don't think the concrete benefits you mentioned
> are much else than subjectivity in values. Supposing
> a user with different values, he might want to know
> what system he should use to get most bone for his
> pennies. And thats what should be in the FAQ as well,
> if we see it as our business to start doing some
> comparative listings.
> 
> If you need to call it p2p, maybe BT is not that. If you
> call it file-sharing, it is definitely that, and works
> surprisingly well for it.
> 
> 
> Igor
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:08:21 +0100
> From: Ian Clarke <address@hidden>
> Subject: Re: [GNUnet-developers] Miscellaneous Ideas
> To: Igor Wronsky <address@hidden>
> Cc: address@hidden
> Message-ID: <address@hidden>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> On Mon, 2004-03-29 at 21:42, Igor Wronsky wrote:
> > So which part of this is a concrete benefit of e.g. GNUnet
> > over BT?
> 
> I was talking about Freenet, I will allow Gnunet developers to 
> speak to
> its benefits over BitTorrent (over which there are several).
> 
> > The Freenet part I already acknowledged by saying
> > that you can't generally rely on pushed content staying
> > in the net.
> 
> How many people do you know have the ability to push content into
> Freenet?  I would say that it basically includes everyone that has an
> Internet connection and a computer capable of running Java.  Now,
> contrast this with the number of people capable of reliably 
> keeping a
> BitTorrent tracker up and running.  I suggest that the former 
> group is
> many times larger than the latter group.
> 
> > These also I did acknowledge by simply making the statement
> > that _supposing_ the user does not need anonymity
> > or censorship resistance (for many, this equals no need
> > to avoid centralization), then how do the things stand?
> 
> Even if you don't care for anonymity, the fact still remains that 
> a user
> must run a BitTorrent tracker for the entire duration of the 
content's
> availability, whereas with Freenet it is "fire and forget".
> 
> The remainder of your email is sufficiently dumb that I don't 
> think it
> requires a response.  If anyone other than you disagrees, please 
> let me
> know and I will spend some time responding.
> 
> Ian.
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> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 16:23:25 -0500
> From: Christian Grothoff <address@hidden>
> Subject: [GNUnet-developers] GNUnet 0.6.1d released
> To: address@hidden, address@hidden,
>       address@hidden
> Message-ID: <address@hidden>
> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="us-ascii"
> 
> The new release fixes various minor bugs: 
> * no error code was returned for incomplete downloads by gnunet-
> download 
> * gnunet-gtk "crashed" if open file limit is reached 
> * gnunetd startup segfault (occured when database library was 
> missing) 
> * random peer selection if bias is unavailable was not done 
> (routing fix) 
> * various Win32 issues (the windows port is still alpha-quality)
> 
> Furthermore, 0.6.1d features: 
> * automatic generation of gnunet.conf if not present 
> * improved formatting for --help output 
> * gnunet-search-sblock was integrated into gnunet-search 
> * the gnunet-directory-* tools were integrated into gnunet-
> directory 
> * the gnunet-pseudonym-* tools were integrated into gnunet-
> pseudonym 
> * better ANSI C compliance (no more [0]-arrays in structs) 
> 
> 0.6.1d is again protocol-compatible and an update should only 
> require 
> recompilation. 
> 
> The sources can be obtained from
> http://www.ovmj.org/GNUnet/download/GNUnet-0.6.1d.tar.bz2
> and all GNU mirrors (once they synchronize).
> 
> RPMs will eventually appear at http://www.ovmj.org/~rpm/.
> Available DEBs are listed at 
> http://packages.debian.org/unstable/net/gnunet.
> Christian
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 02:13:44 +0200
> From: Steffen Pingel <address@hidden>
> Subject: [GNUnet-developers] Freeway Plugin for XNap
> To: address@hidden
> Cc: address@hidden
> Message-ID: <address@hidden>
> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="iso-8859-15"
> 
> Hi,
> 
> let me introduce myself as one of the lead developers of the XNap 
> project 
> (http://xnap.org). XNap is a Java plugin-based P2P framework and 
> client, 
> providing a single Swing-based user interface to common P2P 
protocols.
> 
> We have developed a rudimentary Freeway plugin for XNap that is 
> available from 
> our cvs. It was pretty straightforward to get the search and 
> download code 
> working. It took just about a day. 
> 
> Thanks for your efforts! we think GNUNet will be a valuable 
> addition to XNap. 
> Furthurmore we hope the development of GNUNet can profit from 
> XNap's user 
> base in the (near) future.
> 
> Are there any plans to release a (stable) version of Freeway that 
> we could 
> ship with the plugin (we won't release anything until then)?
> 
> Steffen
> 
> P.S.: Is there a dedicated Freeway development list?
> 
> -- 
> Steffen Pingel - address@hidden - http://steffenpingel.de
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 19:36:29 -0500
> From: Christian Grothoff <address@hidden>
> Subject: Re: [GNUnet-developers] Freeway Plugin for XNap
> To: address@hidden
> Cc: address@hidden, St?phane VALL?E
>       <address@hidden>
> Message-ID: <address@hidden>
> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="iso-8859-15"
> 
> On Wednesday 31 March 2004 19:13, Steffen Pingel wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > let me introduce myself as one of the lead developers of the 
> XNap project
> > (http://xnap.org). XNap is a Java plugin-based P2P framework and 
> client,> providing a single Swing-based user interface to common 
> P2P protocols.
> >
> > We have developed a rudimentary Freeway plugin for XNap that is 
> available> from our cvs. It was pretty straightforward to get the 
> search and download
> > code working. It took just about a day.
> 
> Wow.  
> 
> > Thanks for your efforts! we think GNUNet will be a valuable 
> addition to
> > XNap. Furthurmore we hope the development of GNUNet can profit 
> from XNap's
> > user base in the (near) future.
> 
> Well, I'm sure there are GNUnet users that will like a broader 
> choice of user 
> interfaces :-).
> 
> > Are there any plans to release a (stable) version of Freeway 
> that we could
> > ship with the plugin (we won't release anything until then)?
> 
> I think St├ęphane will have to answer this one :-).
> 
> > Steffen
> >
> > P.S.: Is there a dedicated Freeway development list?
> 
> Not yet.  Savannah's mailinglist creation was still having 
> problems the last 
> time I tried.  I'll create a dedicated freeway mailinglist as soon 
> as 
> possible.  For now, I'd suggest to just use gnunet-developers.
> 
> Christian
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 8
> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 09:40:11 +0300
> From: Jussi Eloranta <address@hidden>
> Subject: [GNUnet-developers] Large disk quota
> To: address@hidden
> Message-ID: <address@hidden>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> 
> If I want to insert large amount of data without indexing (e.g. 
> insert 
> -n) then what is the recommended way of doing it?
> 
> I tried the following. I set disk quota to 50 gb, so that there is 
> enough space. After this (I did remember to reinit the database; 
gdbm)
> the gnunetd refused to startup (ARGH (at xmalloc.c:some number, 
> which I 
> lost - anyway it is the source line number I guess)).
> I simply increased the limit for the check (in xmalloc.c) if(size 
> > 
> 1024 * 1024 * 40) to if(size > 1024 * 1024 * 80) and after
> that it started up and seems to be functioning properly even after 
> inserting huge amount of data (with -n). What is this check for?
> Is it safe to make it larger?
> 
> 
> Jussi Eloranta
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 9
> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 10:59:51 -0500
> From: Christian Grothoff <address@hidden>
> Subject: Re: [GNUnet-developers] Large disk quota
> To: address@hidden
> Message-ID: <address@hidden>
> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> On Thursday 01 April 2004 01:40, Jussi Eloranta wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> >
> > If I want to insert large amount of data without indexing (e.g. 
> insert> -n) then what is the recommended way of doing it?
> 
> Use mysql (very highly recommended).  Use -r for recursive 
> insertion, if you 
> want to get directories add -b.  That should be all (in addition 
> to -n).
> 
> > I tried the following. I set disk quota to 50 gb, so that there is
> > enough space. After this (I did remember to reinit the database; 
> gdbm)> the gnunetd refused to startup (ARGH (at xmalloc.c:some 
> number, which I
> > lost - anyway it is the source line number I guess)).
> > I simply increased the limit for the check (in xmalloc.c) 
> if(size >
> > 1024 * 1024 * 40) to if(size > 1024 * 1024 * 80) and after
> > that it started up and seems to be functioning properly even after
> > inserting huge amount of data (with -n). What is this check for?
> 
> I did not think there was any legitimate code that would allocate 
> more than 40 
> MB, so to protect against unknown overflow bugs (and allocations 
> that might 
> be problematic for machines with not so much memory), this check 
> was put into 
> place.
> 
> > Is it safe to make it larger?
> 
> Yes.  I'll try to see where that huge allocation came from (I 
> suspect it's the 
> bloomfilter), you're probably the first to try such a gigantic 
> amount of 
> space and I guess we should change the code to allow that :-).
> 
> Christian
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GNUnet-developers mailing list
> address@hidden
> http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnunet-developers
> 
> 
> End of GNUnet-developers Digest, Vol 17, Issue 1
> ************************************************
>





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