Re: Communication and Design at Guix

[L p R n d n]

Hello,

Thanks for your feedbacks!

George Clemmer <address@hidden> writes:

> Hi Lprndn,
>
> I am glad to see your interest in these issues.
>
> Ludovic Courtès <address@hidden> writes:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> L  p R n  d n    <address@hidden> skribis:
>>
>>> Ludovic Courtès <address@hidden> writes:
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>>> A very concrete task that could be of interest to you is the “name
>>>> change” (a bit of a strong word) that we’d like to implement by 1.0.
>>>> I’ll try to summarize.  Currently we have “Guix” and “GuixSD”, and that
>>>> confuses things: people visit the web site, they see a “GuixSD” logo and
>>>> get confused because they were just looking for a package manager, not a
>>>> whole distro, or they think “GuixSD” is a storage device ;-), things
>>>> like that.
>>>>
>>>> The idea is to bring everything under the “Guix” name.  Most of the
>>>> time, writing “Guix” is good enough—after all, one can run ‘guix system’
>>>> on a foreign distro, too.  When we really need to make the distinction,
>>>> for instance in the manual, we would write “Guix System” to designate
>>>> what we currently call “GuixSD”.
>>>
>>> Hum. It might just be as easy as getting rid of the GuixSD logo and
>>> wording for the most part. Then we can find a *preferred* way to
>>> designate GuixSD (a Guix system (probably), Guix distro, Guix os).Here,
>>> it's more about making GuixSD "disappear" but we could also just rebrand
>>> GuixSD with some kind of "subtitle": "Guix, the system", derive a logo
>>> from the Guix's one. It depends a lot from what we want to put under
>>> the spotlight.
>>
>> The idea is more to have a single “brand”: Guix.
>
> Yes a single brand is the way to go. But, piecemeal changes to the web
> site are unlikely to get us there unless we work from a unified "Guix
> Brand" product description. E.g., earlier I proposed ...
>
> "'Guix' is a software environment manager that creates user environments
> that are completely and independently specified by users. Guix users are
> never stuck needing software that a Sysadmin can't, won't, or hasn't
> installed. A Guix user can run multiple, differing environments
> simultaneously and can replicate any environment on any Guix run-time
> platform.  Guix provides system-wide environment management when
> appropriate to the run-time platform.  Creation, modification, and
> upgrade are atomic and roll-back is instantaneous, so Guix users and
> sysadmins are never stuck with a broken user environment or system.
> Guix implements a functional specification of package, user, and system
> configurations using the Scheme language.  Guix complies with the FSF
> Four Essential Freedoms and Free System Distribution Guidelines and
> provides easy and immediate access to the exact source being run.  By
> default, Guix uses pre-built package substitutes from the Guix build
> farm and mirrors but users may build any package, or a complete system,
> from package developer sources."[1]

Yeah, I didn't totally get the single "brand" Guix, at first. ;)
This paragraph is nice! It's probably usable as is but I think it could
benefits from a little refactoring (multiple parts by usecase or
possible user?). I'll try to give it a go if you don't mind.

>> Then “Guix System” would be a component of Guix, so to speak, similar
>> to GNOME and its applications.
>
> "Guix System" is a "bad" name for "GuixSD." Why? Because a new user's
> first expectation is for "Guix system" to refer to the whole of Guix,
> which we want to call "Guix" (referred to as "Guix Brand" below).
>
> But if we call GuixSD the "Guix System", we create a counter-intuitive
> thing to explain. E.g., we will be saying, "Our GNU/Linux System
> Distribution, 'Guix System' is just one of multiple ways to use 'Guix
> Brand', which includes the Guix package manager, for which we also use
> the 'Guix Brand' label.
>
> Another "bad" thing about calling it "Guix system" is that when a user
> searches "guix system" they hit the 'guix system' "Guix Brand" package
> manager' command that, BTW, also generates "Guix VMs".
>
> It will simplify our work if we present GuixSD as simply one of several
> Guix download/deployment options. E.g., earlier I suggested ...
>
> "Guix is available on multiple run-time platforms including bare metal
> (GuixSD), Virtual Machines (QEMU image), and any GNU/Linux distro (Guix
> Binary).[1]"
>
> With this approach, we only need a distinctive label for GuixSD that
> doesn't puzzle users to produce reliable search hits on the relevant
> parts of our message and documentation. E.g., GuixOS.

I understand. 
Currently, I'm searching for some kind of one liner to describe Guix.
Something that quickly describe what Guix is.
In your previous paragraph you use "software environment manager".
Personnaly, I can't say if it works, I don't think I have the necessary
knowledge to get it. If other guix users thinks it's easily
understandable it should be ok. Otherwise, I was more with things like
this:

Guix is ...

... a package and system manager. (A seen previously, system manager is
too wide)
... a package manager and machine administrator.
... a package and machine administrator.
... a package and environment manager. 

WDYT? If anyone has an idea, don't be shy :)

I'd like to keep the "package manager" part as it'll probably ring a
bell to any linux user and helps understand the not so familiar part
(system/environment dealing).


> HTH - George
>
> [1] https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guix-devel/2018-01/msg00444.html

Have a nice day,

Lprndn