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Re: Doc: NR - Doc CSS colour support (issue 551270043 by address@hidden)

From: rietveldpkx
Subject: Re: Doc: NR - Doc CSS colour support (issue 551270043 by address@hidden)
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2019 02:28:13 -0800

On 2019/12/20 00:45:05, dak wrote:
On 2019/12/20 00:01:59, lemzwerg wrote:
> > > There should always a comma after 'i.e.', as far as I know.
> >
> > Nope.  It's grammatical dogma (in the same vein as not
> > starting sentences with the words 'And' or 'Because).
> > I think commas after these abbreviations look ugly.
> I'm not a native speaker, but I think exactly the opposite, given
that 'i.e.'
> means 'that is' and 'e.g.' means 'for example'.

I don't understand your point. The lack of commas here does not in any
way, shape, or form, create an ambiguity of meaning. If I were to write
out the 'translation' of i.e. in full then perhaps you'd have a point,
but then only if the sentence required it.

> > > This is especially important for the PDFs since by default
> > > `texinfo.tex` doesn't use frenchspacing, thus inserting a
> > larger horizontal space after a full stop.
> >
> > So?  If it were that bad why are we using two spaces after
> > a full point then?
> I'm talking about the printed *output*.  Having two spaces in the
> is a convention to better support editors like Emacs who use those
spaces to
> recognize sentence endings, allowing quick sentence-wise navigation.
> > Which has nothing to do with grammar and would mean this would
have to be
> > policy (which it isn't) and fixed throughout the entire doc.
> By default, texinfo follows the convention of inserting more
horizontal space
> after a full stop in the printed output (both info and PDF).  Having
> additional space looks extremely ugly if it is not the end of a
sentence (like
> in abbreviations 'e.g.' or 'i.e.').  We have three possibilities to
fix this.
> (1) Insert a comma after such abbreviations.  This is what I would
do, and I
> already tried to handle that in a uniform way in a few previous
commits (at
> least for the NR).  BTW, you might check whether the majority cases
in the
> are either 'e.g.,' or 'e.g.'.
> (2) Insert `@:` after a full stop that doesn't end a sentence.
> (3) Insert the command `@frenchspacing on` in the preamble to
disable this
> American typography feature.
> We *must* do one of the three solutions.  Otherwise we get really
ugly output
> the info and PDF formats.

Chicago manual of style says:
<>, namely use a
comma here.
  The two-space after period rule for Emacs is not just for sentence
but also for auto-fill-mode (and various other commands) to refrain
creating a line wrap in the middle of an abbreviation.

Whether or not we care about the grammatical dogma of the U.S. centric
Manual of Style, TeX (and in consequence Texinfo) have doctored their
conventions around that.  TeX does not add sentence-end space after a
letter followed by a period, like Donald E. Knuth, but has no such
qualms after
lowercase letters.  And for better or worse, we do follow U.S. usage
(like with
spellings of color and center rather than colour and centre) in the
documentation in general.

I've never understood the point of two spaces after a full point - and
and yes, I've read all the (unconvincing) arguments for it.

Yet at the same time, I see the amount of hand wringing and discussion
on these lists about all the various spacing preferences (slurs-vs-ties
differences or the size of a ball on the end of a clef) as well as all
the other musical notation minutiae that is so important to us, which is
why I find this discussion rather disappointing.

Bugger to the Chicago Manual of (so called) Style!

New patch uploaded.

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