Re: Percussion and tab clefs question

[Torsten Hämmerle]

Hello Jacques,

Just a few additions to Joram's remarks...


Noeck wrote
> I guess the pitches are undefined in both the tab clef and the
> percussion clef.

As for the percussion clef, MusicXML uses treble clef positioning and -
obviously - so does Finale.
In LilyPond, they are not intended resp. not defined for use in a regular
Staff (see below).


Noeck wrote
> The percussion clef might have some pitched instruments, but there is no
> universal definition (to my knowledge).

For exactly that reason, MusicXML provides <unpitched> and <midi-unpitched>
for use with unpitched percussion and I don't think <pitch> does make too
much sense for unpitched percussion instruments.

Example: Open and closed Hi Hat will have the same position within the stave
and thus the same <unpitched> value, but different MIDI pitches
<midi-unpitched> because they are different sounds in a MIDI drumkit.


Noeck wrote
> Finale seems to use positions like in a treble clef for both the tab and
> the percussion clef. Which is understandable as it is the closest to a
> default clef.

Yes. And LilyPond doen't have deliberate settings at all because these clefs
don't make any sense (i.e. are undefined pitch-wise) in a Staff environment
and incidentally behave like an alto clef:


Noeck wrote
> LilyPond seems to use an alto clef positions for both – which I don't
> understand why this would be beneficial.

The TAB clef in LilyPond is intended for use in tablatures only, when using
it in a Staff, c' will be positioned on the middle stave line (Y-offset 0),
that incidentally happens to be the alto clef setting.
So, in my opinion, it's sheer coincidence.

When looking at the LilyPond clef settings, there's always a 0 0 (Y-offset,
octave) for these "non-pitched" clefs (tab is not really unpitched, but
intended for tablature only):

    ("percussion" . ("clefs.percussion" 0 0))
    ("varpercussion" . ("clefs.varpercussion" 0 0))
    ("tab" . ("clefs.tab" 0 0))


*Conclusion:* On the one hand, it's fine to check the correct output in
different clefs, but as far as (unpitched) percussion clefs or tablature
clefs in a non-tablature environment are concerned, they are not intended
for this use (i.e. undefined) and may produce different results (or even
errors) in different notation programs.


All the best,
Torsten




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