Re: existing work on TODO items

[Ken Manheimer]

On 1/9/06, Richard M. Stallman <address@hidden> wrote:

>     Sure, but mostly the latter.  Just the code size (1/4 MB of allout)
>     must be significant.  It's not just maintenance, though; it affects
>     interactive and programmatic users too.  For instance, if allout was
>     built on outline, it would be obvious to us that it was at least a
>     superset, and there would be mode-specific support which doesn't seem
>     to have been programmed for allout.
>
> Ken, what do you think about that?  Would it be feasible to
> rewrite allout.el to be based on outline.el?  (We would
> install this after the release.)

i addressed this to some degree in one of my replies to dave love, but
you probably didn't see that before your response, here.  my comments
were incomplete and buried in a lengthy message, so i'll be more
direct, here:

 - allout diverges enough from outline-mode code, both internally
   and in external behavior, that i think some changes to outline.el
   would be required to retain desired allout behaviors.  those
   changes could quite possibly be extensive.

 - curious about potential performance issues, i transformed an
   allout outline which i work with most frequently (my 1.2 MB
   daily activities log - which i'm often editing, every day) to
   outline-mode format (changed the headers prefix), and i
   noticed some severe performance problems which are absent
   in allout-mode.  i expect that these problems would cripple allout
   for my most common uses, and i have no idea what fixing them
   would entail.

for these reasons, basing allout on outline.el would not be my first goal.

in addition, my strong interest at this point is implementing
desirable outline functionality using emacs widgets, if feasible. 
this would depart from both the outline and allout approaches.  i
have, in fact, set aside time for investigating this and am actively
working on it, though gradually.  (i alluded to this interest earlier
in our conversation, though was not very clear about it.)

altogether, i would prefer to continue directing my effort towards
evaluating and, if it looks promising, developing a widget-based
outliner, rather than spending any time consolidating the allout and
outline.el code base.  if feasible, i think that could result in a
better direction for all concerned.

Ken Manheimer
address@hidden