Re: GSWeb/GDL2 Status

[Helge Hess]

On 21.11.2007, at 22:15, Thom Cherryhomes wrote:
> the big problem I see is.... and you guys really can't dispute  
> this....
>
> Unless you already KNOW how to use EOF and WO....
>
> YOU CAN'T USE THESE TOOLKITS!

I totally agree. If you actually want arbitary other people use them,  
you need some excellent and up to date documentation. Not a top  
priority for me.
But then, neither SOPE nor gstep-web ever will be useful to  
"mainstream" people. That already starts at the language choice.

> They're in my eyes, half done, half baked, missing the other side of
> the tools that made these frameworks great in the first place.

Well, they were usually developed for a specific purpose, not for the  
general public. For the ones who use them, they do their task. So I  
would hardly call them "half baked".

> (I also
> submit that WO in general is in desperate need of lessons learned in
> the last few years, such as prettier URLs, REST modelling etc.).....

WO 4 added WODirectAction which is basically the same thing like RoR  
controllers, and you would hardly call that deprecated. And even RoR  
started out with that crap despite the fact that Zope/ZPublisher  
already demonstrated a great approach for doing REST.
[well and BTW SOPE *does* has extensive REST support]

And both, Zope and RoR, still do manual request parameter / form  
handling. They still do not have something which even remotely  
provides what a WOComponent does.

But still, you are right, those WO concepts are not well explained.  
Something like the ZopeBook and great sample apps would be required  
for other people interested.

> so until these parts are at least functional....these toolkits are
> only of use to those of you who live in that little world.

Oh well, the traditional "if you do not have XYZ I can't use it"  
argument, great! ;-)

> yes, I'm being a snit. All of you have spent just a wee bit too much
> time in your ivory towers coding this stuff for your own use.

Not exactly sure I can follow your point here. None of the frameworks  
is coded for "own use". They are used in commercial applications for  
10 years or more.
[maybe that the issue with gnustep-gui, I think no one uses that part  
commercially]

Greets,
  Helge
--
Helge Hess
http://www.helgehess.eu/