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Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU
From: |
Jeremy Petzold |
Subject: |
Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU |
Date: |
Wed, 18 Jul 2001 06:54:00 -0700 (PDT) |
I would like to comment,
What ever decision is made about this, I would like to
say that we should not and can not exclude Java from
our platform, It should have just as much access to it
as we give C#, this will ensure lots of developers
that will use our system, and it will give us a rout
to exclude C# if the need ever arises (like M$ doing
some extremely Draconian tactic to destroy all
competition who use it, it could happen).
-Jeremy
--- Martin Coxall <address@hidden> wrote:
> > I like to hear the technical shortcomings of Java.
>
> Well, okay, but I think you're missing the point.
> Java does have technical
> shortcomings, but it is its heinous legal
> shortcomings that make it an
> unacceptable choice for dotGNU.
>
> So, bearing in mind that the Legal shortcomings are
> really the reason I would
> hate to see dotGNU adopt it, here are the some
> technical reasons why I feel
> the Java platform is lacking.
>
> Java only supports heap-allocated reference types.
> There is no way to support
> pass-by-value concrete types in Java.
>
> Java does not support even elementary well-behaved
> infix operator
> overloading. For readable numerics or mathematical
> coding this is essential.
>
> Java's numerics support is terrible. (Infinities and
> NaN's are not properly
> handled, Java refuses access to hardware features
> supported by 95% of
> processors, 'Loose' numerics libraries)
>
> Generics support is not designed into the bytecode
> specification. Java's
> "erasure" proposal amount to little more than
> removing the generic types at
> compile time. (The Mono CLR can have generics
> support at the IL language
> level, as first-class types, and C# will have
> generics in its next release.)
>
> Java does not support type-safe enums, boxing and
> unboxing of primitive value
> types (who likes writing int one = new
> Integer(oneString).intValue() ?), and
> concise object array literals for variable-length
> function prototypes or out
> parameters.
>
> Java's AWT is minimal in scope and almost useless.
> Swing is slooooow, doesn't
> emulate the look and feel of any GNU/Linux desktop,
> and doesn't follow theme
> rules specified by the user, because it's all done
> using drawing primitives.
>
> The Garbage Collector can be fooled into causing
> memory leaks, due to the way
> weak references are handled in the Java Language
> Specification.
>
> Object finalisation is erratic, and Java provides no
> clean way (e.g. C++
> destructors, C# using(:IDispose) ) of ensuring that
> scarce resources are
> freed up when an object loses scope.
>
> Strings have + overloaded at the LANGUAGE level, yet
> == does not test string
> equality, it tests *reference* equality.
>
> Arrays behave like objects at some points, yet not
> at others.
>
> The Java Native Interface is clumsy and slow.
>
> Java bytecodes are designed to be interpreted. This
> means that you may never
> get optimal JIT performance, as you will with a
> language designed to be
> JITted, e.g. Mono's CLR Intermediate Language.
>
> I'll stop there, I think. I believe I have
> adequately demonstrated that Java
> has many technical flaws as well as its veritable
> cavalcade of legal
> obstacles.
>
> ---
> Martin
> ---
>
> "Where laughing and smiling are not allowed"
>
> _______________________________________________
> Developers mailing list
> address@hidden
> http://dotgnu.org/mailman/listinfo/developers
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- Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, (continued)
Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, Norbert Bollow, 2001/07/18
Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, Jeremy Petzold, 2001/07/16
Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, Jeremy Petzold, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, Martin Coxall, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, Kent Nguyen, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, Martin Coxall, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU,
Jeremy Petzold <=
- Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, Martin Coxall, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, Norbert Bollow, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Re: Support Java for .GNU, Martin Coxall, 2001/07/18
- [DotGNU]Choice of bytecode spec (was: Support Java for .GNU), Norbert Bollow, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Choice of bytecode spec (was: Support Java for .GNU), David Sugar, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Choice of bytecode spec (was: Support Java for .GNU), Norbert Bollow, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Choice of bytecode spec (was: Support Java for .GNU), Adam Theo, 2001/07/18
- Re: [DotGNU]Choice of bytecode spec (was: Support Java for .GNU), tali streit, 2001/07/19
Java issues, and Microsoft.NET compatibility (was Re: [DotGNU]Choice of bytecode spec (was: Support Java for .GNU)), Bradley M. Kuhn, 2001/07/22
Re: Java issues, and Microsoft.NET compatibility (was Re: [DotGNU]Choice of bytecode spec (was: Support Java for .GNU)), Bradley M. Kuhn, 2001/07/22