[DotGNU]RE: Developers digest, Vol 1 #168 - 9 msgs

[Gary L. Sun]

Here is a TOC Barry and I discussed way back. Take a
look, if it fits dotGNU needs. Besides the TOC, partial
doc is written not complete yet. It should be a joint team
efforts (at least it is supposed to be).

Gary
#-----Original Message-----
#From: address@hidden [mailto:address@hidden
#Behalf Of address@hidden
#Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2001 12:13 AM
#To: address@hidden
#Subject: Developers digest, Vol 1 #168 - 9 msgs
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#When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
#than "Re: Contents of Developers digest..."
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#Today's Topics:
#
#   1. Web transports (Rikard Linde)
#   2. Re: Web transports (Norbert Bollow)
#   3. Developers: What .Net will cost you (Bill Lance)
#   4. Re: Developers: What .Net will cost you (Rhys Weatherley)
#   5. New ECMA specifications released (Rhys Weatherley)
#   6. Re: Developers: What .Net will cost you (Dan Kuykendall (Seek3r))
#   7. Re: Developers: What .Net will cost you (Bill Lance)
#   8. Simple Web Services API (Bill Lance)
#   9. Re: Developers: What .Net will cost you (David J. Thomson)
#
#--__--__--
#
#Message: 1
#Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 12:12:37 -0700 (PDT)
#From: Rikard Linde <address@hidden>
#Reply-To: address@hidden
#To: address@hidden
#Subject: [DotGNU]Web transports
#
#Hi. I've started writing a document about "web
#transports" that describes a web equivalent to Jabber
#Transports. It's intended to be a starting point for
#discussions and I'll be talking about the idea in the
#next Jabber-DotGNU meeting (Thursday 19:00 GMT/ 3pm in
#New York/ 12pm in LA in address@hidden).
#Are there plans for something similar that I'm not
#aware of? Is it within the scope of DotGNU? Ideas?
#Criticism? Thwaps?
#
#http://www.sprinterface.com/webtransports.html
#
#Rikard
#
#
#__________________________________________________
#Do You Yahoo!?
#Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals.
#http://personals.yahoo.com
#
#--__--__--
#
#Message: 2
#Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 21:38:57 +0200
#From: Norbert Bollow <address@hidden>
#To: address@hidden
#CC: address@hidden
#Subject: Re: [DotGNU]Web transports
#
#> http://www.sprinterface.com/webtransports.html
#
#What problems of webservice providers, or webservice users does
#this help solve?
#
#Greetings, Norbert.
#
#-- 
#A member of FreeDevelopers and the DotGNU Steering Committee: dotgnu.org
#Norbert Bollow, Weidlistr.18, CH-8624 Gruet   (near Zurich, Switzerland)
#Tel +41 1 972 20 59       Fax +41 1 972 20 69      http://thinkcoach.com
#Your own domain with all your Mailman lists: $15/month  http://cisto.com
#
#--__--__--
#
#Message: 3
#Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 14:22:15 -0700 (PDT)
#From: Bill Lance <address@hidden>
#To: address@hidden
#Subject: [DotGNU]Developers: What .Net will cost you
#
#Another facet of .NET
#
#
#http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-7629784.html?tag=pt.rss..feed.
#ne_7629784
#
#
#An average developer will pay MS $10,000 a year?
#
#
#__________________________________________________
#Do You Yahoo!?
#Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals.
#http://personals.yahoo.com
#
#--__--__--
#
#Message: 4
#Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 10:13:52 +1000
#From: Rhys Weatherley <address@hidden>
#To: Bill Lance <address@hidden>
#CC: address@hidden
#Subject: Re: [DotGNU]Developers: What .Net will cost you
#
#Bill Lance wrote:
#
#> Another facet of .NET
#>
#> 
#http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-7629784.html?tag=pt.rss..feed.
#ne_7629784
#>
#> An average developer will pay MS $10,000 a year?
#
#An MSDN subscription currently costs over A$3000
#(US$1500) per year.  And that's just for a bunch of
#compilers and documentation and stuff.  Charging
#developers high prices is not new for Microsoft.
#
#This probably refers to hosting the application on
#Microsoft's servers, or to have it linked from one
#of Microsoft's servers.
#
#If you want to create your own application and host it
#on your own system, with no direct links from Microsoft,
#you should be able to do that.  However, without that
#direct link, you won't have as great of exposure and
#may lose traffic because of it.
#
#i.e. Microsoft is essentially selling search engine space
#for Web services.  If you are on the search engine,
#you get greater exposure than if you aren't.  They
#intend to be the Yahoo of Web services.
#
#The way to counter this is very simple: set up a service
#that will list Web services for free, or very cheaply,
#and then promote it as an alternative.  If it becomes
#popular, then it will have the exposure benefits without
#the high developer cost.
#
#Cheers,
#
#Rhys.
#
#
#
#--__--__--
#
#Message: 5
#Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 11:22:33 +1000
#From: Rhys Weatherley <address@hidden>
#To: address@hidden
#Subject: [DotGNU]New ECMA specifications released
#
#The ECMA specifications have been updated:
#
#http://msdn.microsoft.com/net/ecma/
#
#Of course, Microsoft released them with a complete and
#total lack of fanfare, so I only discovered them today even
#though they probably came out a few weeks ago. :-(
#
#Cheers,
#
#Rhys.
#
#
#
#--__--__--
#
#Message: 6
#Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 23:47:04 -0700
#From: "Dan Kuykendall (Seek3r)" <address@hidden>
#To: Bill Lance <address@hidden>
#CC: address@hidden
#Subject: Re: [DotGNU]Developers: What .Net will cost you
#
#This is going to be a mess for end users/consumers.
#Take this scenario
#Startup Inc. has an idea for a great application, and they want to
#leverage some resources from .NET MyServices so they sign up and start
#paying MS the $1000 per year plus the $250 for their app they write.
#
#Startup Inc. sells several copies of their app but doesnt make enough to
#stay in business and ends up falling apart.
#Now this means that at the next point where Startup Inc. is suppose to
#pay their annual fee and they dont, Microsoft will cut access to .NET
#MyServices for their app. Which means all the users of this program can
#no longer user the program they bought from the now collapsed Startup
#Inc.
#
#This of course doesnt even begin to deal with the issue that us Free
#Software developers are going to have to deal with... but this is really
#going to be bad for the industry.
#
#Seek3r
#
#Bill Lance wrote:
#> 
#> Another facet of .NET
#> 
#> 
#http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-7629784.html?tag=pt.rss..feed.
#ne_7629784
#> 
#> An average developer will pay MS $10,000 a year?
#> 
#> __________________________________________________
#> Do You Yahoo!?
#> Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals.
#> http://personals.yahoo.com
#> _______________________________________________
#> Developers mailing list
#> address@hidden
#> http://subscribe.dotgnu.org/mailman/listinfo/developers
#
#--__--__--
#
#Message: 7
#Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 06:41:09 -0700 (PDT)
#From: Bill Lance <address@hidden>
#Subject: Re: [DotGNU]Developers: What .Net will cost you
#To: "Dan Kuykendall \(Seek3r\)" <address@hidden>
#Cc: address@hidden
#
#
#--- "Dan Kuykendall (Seek3r)" <address@hidden>
#wrote:
#> This is going to be a mess for end users/consumers.
#
#Indeed.  Several years ago I was using an online
#storage service called mydocs.  It would be called a
#WebService today.  Let me store files that were
#accessable from anywhere on the net.  Sound familiar?
#They went down the tubes, with what files I had there.
#(nothing of value, of course.  I essentially used it
#as a way of transfereing files between home and
#office.  Temporary stuff only.)
#
#This is an achilies heel of any remote network
#service, what ever it's called.  It is only as
#reliable as individual companies.  (Or profit centers
#within larger companies.  MS is certainly not shy
#about pulling the plug on services it find
#inconvienent.)
#
#
#> 
#> This of course doesnt even begin to deal with the
#> issue that us Free
#> Software developers are going to have to deal
#> with... but this is really
#> going to be bad for the industry.
#> 
#> Seek3r
#> 
#
#It will be only if there is no other choice to
#accomplish tasks important to users.  None of the user
#problems I've heard mentioned here (consolidated
#personal data management, access to persoanl data from
#remote devices, site password management-indintity)
#REQUIRE a central service model like .NET.  Nor do any
#of the proposed b2b uses that I've heard of (thu I'm
#not real familiar with this area.)  Hopefull, dotgnu
#will be a source of some of those alternatives
#
#
#
#__________________________________________________
#Do You Yahoo!?
#Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals.
#http://personals.yahoo.com
#
#--__--__--
#
#Message: 8
#Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 08:34:35 -0700 (PDT)
#From: Bill Lance <address@hidden>
#To: address@hidden
#Subject: [DotGNU]Simple Web Services API
#
#Is this project of relevance to dotgnu?  ActiveState
#at least talks of opensource.
#
#http://aspn.ActiveState.com/ASPN/WebServices/SWSAPI/spec
#
#
#
#
#__________________________________________________
#Do You Yahoo!?
#Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals.
#http://personals.yahoo.com
#
#--__--__--
#
#Message: 9
#Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 11:55:29 -0400 (EDT)
#From: "David J. Thomson" <address@hidden>
#To: Bill Lance <address@hidden>
#Cc: "Dan Kuykendall (Seek3r)" <address@hidden>,
#       <address@hidden>
#Subject: Re: [DotGNU]Developers: What .Net will cost you
#
#> It will be only if there is no other choice to
#> accomplish tasks important to users.  None of the user
#> problems I've heard mentioned here (consolidated
#> personal data management, access to persoanl data from
#> remote devices, site password management-indintity)
#> REQUIRE a central service model like .NET.  Nor do any
#> of the proposed b2b uses that I've heard of (thu I'm
#> not real familiar with this area.)  Hopefull, dotgnu
#> will be a source of some of those alternatives
#
#There is a prototype of a new software application/framework called the
#cybersphere available from ATA Cycle. It allows you to send and receive
#messages, have threaded conversations, publish/edit documents, and more,
#all without any monopolized servers. You can set up your own
#communications node (called a "concentre") just by downloading and
#installing it. If you have a static (or even semi-static) IP on the
#Internet you can start providing a secure communications "medium of
#mediums" for your friends, family, village, or community.
#
#The license, however, is not GPL because the true source is not yet
#available.  :( Don't fret, because you can make it GPL! All you have to do
#is figure out which five lines of code were intentionally omitted from the
#included source code, and the whole thing becomes public domain and you
#can do whatever you want with it, including releasing it under the GPL.
#Until that happens, only certified distributors such as ATA Cycle
#(www.atabike.com) and Infraweb (www.infraweb.com) are permitted to
#distribute it.
#
#If you are the one that identifies the five lines, you or the the group
#you choose to represent will automatically be offered a free certified
#distribution license for the next release. Furthermore, if you are the
#73rd person to send a memo through the cybersphere to ATA Cycle, the Best
#Bike Shop in Boston two years running according to Boston Magazine (find
#them in your contacts list), you will receive a free bike! Check out ATA
#Cycle at http://www.atabike.com/cybersphere.html for more details.
#
#-David
#
#
#
#--__--__--
#
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#Developers mailing list
address@hidden
#http://subscribe.dotgnu.org/mailman/listinfo/developers
#
#
#End of Developers Digest

dotgnu_TOC.txt
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