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## Re: minimal examples

 From: Hans Aberg Subject: Re: minimal examples Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2007 11:21:18 +0100

On 7 Dec 2007, at 02:20, Graham Percival wrote:


Hans Aberg wrote:

When I made the first report, I had no idea what was causing it. All I knew was that replacing the quadruplet with a rest made it problem disappear, so it looked to me as though that was the problem. You, with your broader knowledge of LilyPond bugs,


I wish that people would stop assuming that I know what I'm doing. For bugs, I simply spend five minutes experimenting. For example, starting from this:

\relative c' {
\key d \minor
\time 12/16

\times 3/4 {g'8 f8} f4 \pitchedTrill f8. \startTrillSpan ges f8 \stopTrillSpan |
}

I did the following.


1) Is there a bug? ...compile, view... ok, there's no flat on the ges.


2) The \times looks irrelevant; what happens if I replace it by g4 f4?
... compile, view... ok, bug still present.


3) What about the \time? That looks really silly. Let's remove that, and change all the durations to 4.
... compile, view... ok, bug still present.

4)  Key signature?  remove, compile, view.  Bug still present.


5) What about removing the \pitchedTrill ? remove, compile, view... ah, of course. Bug not present, but neither is the ges, so that was silly. Let's put the \pitchedTrill back in there.



At no point did my supposed knowledge of lilypond come into play. All I ever do is experiment. I mean, I don't even know how \pitchedTrill and \spanner stuff works, as was evident from my trying to deleting them.


Oh, also by "remove", I mean "comment out, compile to test, and only actually delete the item once I've verified that I still see a bug when it's commented out". I learned this trick the hard way.


Sure you have a lot experience with structure of LilyPond bugs, you even describe that it several places. If you want to cut down on your own time, drop off hints as you did to me first time: "Is this or that really necessary?" Then people not only can go on with reshaping the example, but will learn how to do it for you. I have been on the Bison lists for a decade, and it is common to deal with bug reports where people send whole programs. To Apple, I have in some cases sent in whole DVDs. One files a bug report, and the people set to handle the bug should be able to indicate how the example should progress. In some cases, I set up on their suggestions, I set up my computer running for days. So if you want have bug reports have special form, you need to find effieicnt ways to communicate that. In the case above, I took out two notes of the quadruplet, and it did not change the bug, so it was reasonable to assume it was the quadruplet causing the bug, nd getting your opinion about that; only when I typed the letter, I got the idea it might be the g. You could then use the suggestion I made to further. This kind of interaction is typical for bug reports. I have also done bug reports for compilers since the early 1990s.

Hans Aberg