Re: [Discuss-gnuradio] Regarding the updating and extending gr-radar idea for GSoc 2018

[Martin Braun]

On 03/05/2018 04:10 PM, suraj hanchinal wrote:
> Thanks for the response. I was mainly interested in passive radar and
> also was into the idea of passive WiFi radar. As I said I have been
> reading research papers like this one 
> http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/6020778/ . This paper has a method
> of using WiFi AP for passive target detection. This could further be
> used for applications as well and the algorithms are also said to work
> for other types of signals as well. I am also looking into WiFi passive
> radar using symbol reconstruction as well for better results. What is
> your opinion on this?

I think I may have read this in past, but I can't access it now
(paywall). That said, it's a fun way to go forward.

-- M
> Thanking you,
>  Suraj Hanchinal
> 
> On Mon, Mar 5, 2018 at 11:44 PM, Martin Braun <address@hidden
> <mailto:address@hidden>> wrote:
> 
>     Suraj, (and going back to the ML),
> 
>     first question is: What are *you* interested in? We have suggested 4
>     overarching topics (SAR, Passive Radar, Apps, Multi-antenna). You'd have
>     to be *extremely* productive to get more then one or two done during
>     GSoC.
> 
>     You've indicated interest in passive radar and multi-antenna, and
>     specifically pointed out the idea of using Wifi signals (great project!)
>     for passive radar. Frankly, if you can pull that off, that would cover
>     both the passive radar side, and the apps side (because you could build
>     something on top of your wifi passive radar to e.g. catch speeding cars,
>     or maybe do something completely different.
> 
>     Thinking outside of the wifi signal topic for a moment, there's plenty
>     of people who have done passive radar with GNU Radio, but ironically not
>     with gr-radar. A simple cross-correlation approach based on any existing
>     broadcast signal would be a good start, too. Plus, you can use wifi
>     dongles for such an application. It would be nice to have out-of-the-box
>     passive radar experiments ready to run provided in gr-radar.
>     Another "downside" of the current codes is that for experiments, you
>     need devices that have both native support for timed commands, high
>     bandwidth, and Tx capabilities -- basically, USRPs. A passive radar
>     example could also work with RTL SDR dongles. That would be a cheaper
>     intro to the toolbox.
> 
>     Cheers,
>     Martin
> 
>     On 03/05/2018 06:50 AM, suraj hanchinal wrote:
>     > Thanks a lot for the response. I have read about the passive radar
>     > signal processing as well as parts of your thesis on ofdm radar to
>     > familiarise myself with the above mentioned technique. I have also
>     > studied the entire code of gr- radar to familiarise myself with that. I
>     > am also reading up on research papers for the same. I wanted to ask
>     > about the scope of the implementation in the sense that what should the
>     > extension to the toolbox contain. Please enlighten me on this.
>     >
>     > Thanking you,
>     > Suraj Hanchinal 
>     >
>     > On Mar 1, 2018 1:19 AM, "Martin Braun" <address@hidden 
> <mailto:address@hidden>
>     > <mailto:address@hidden <mailto:address@hidden>>>
>     wrote:
>     >
>     >     On 02/24/2018 05:34 AM, suraj hanchinal wrote:
>     >     > Hello Everyone,
>     >     > I am planning to apply for GSoc 2018. I was very interested
>     and would
>     >     > love to work on the gr-radar toolbox. I was interested
>     specifically in
>     >     > implementing passive-radar and multi-antenna support to
>     gr-radar.
>     >     Since
>     >     > a passive radar system would need a multi-antenna support
>     anyways, I
>     >     > think they could be implemented together. I have been
>     reading some
>     >     > research papers regarding passive radars to get a better
>     understanding
>     >     > and I think implementing a passive radar to use FM
>     transmitters nearby
>     >     > to locate objects as a good starting point and then turn to
>     using wifi
>     >     > access points in an area as the next step. I am currently
>     developing a
>     >     > proper write-up as well for the same. I would kindly request
>     you to
>     >     > point out any things I should know of or just general
>     suggestions
>     >     on the
>     >     > subject. I would also kindly request the mentors Martin
>     Braun and
>     >     Stefan
>     >     > Wansch to enlighten me on this.
>     >
>     >     Suraj,
>     >
>     >     thanks for your interest in GSoC and gr-radar! Passive radar would
>     >     indeed be a pretty nifty addition. It's probably easier to get
>     better
>     >     results using more high-bandwidth signals with better
>     cross-correlation
>     >     properties, such as terrestrial TV stations.
>     >
>     >     Note that I assume that you have some familiarity with the signal
>     >     processing fundamentals of passive radar. That said, you can
>     do a lot
>     >     better than cross-correlating when doing passive radar with OFDM
>     >     signals, but that's a little too much to lay out in a short
>     email (in a
>     >     nutshell, you can recreate the original tx'd signal and use
>     symbols as
>     >     samples in the time-frequency domain to generate range/Doppler
>     diagrams
>     >     without having to worry about cross-correlation artefacts).
>     >
>     >     Also go check out Juha Vierinen's work (e.g., this:
>     >   
>      
> https://hackaday.com/2015/06/05/building-your-own-sdr-based-passive-radar-on-a-shoestring/
>     
> <https://hackaday.com/2015/06/05/building-your-own-sdr-based-passive-radar-on-a-shoestring/>
>     >   
>      
> <https://hackaday.com/2015/06/05/building-your-own-sdr-based-passive-radar-on-a-shoestring/
>     
> <https://hackaday.com/2015/06/05/building-your-own-sdr-based-passive-radar-on-a-shoestring/>>,
>     >     an old blog post I googled real quick). And of course Jean-Michel's 
> work
>     >     that Phil mentioned.
>     >
>     >     -- M
>     >
>     >     _______________________________________________
>     >     Discuss-gnuradio mailing list
>     >    address@hidden <mailto:address@hidden>
>     <mailto:address@hidden <mailto:address@hidden>>
>     >     https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
>     <https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio>
>     >     <https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio
>     <https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss-gnuradio>>
>     >
>     >
> 
>