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Re: [emacs-bidi] Bidi - will it happen ?

From: Tim Freedom
Subject: Re: [emacs-bidi] Bidi - will it happen ?
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 13:05:37 -0700 (PDT)

On Sun, 16 Jun 2002 09:04:53 +0300 (IDT),
  "Eli Zaretskii" <address@hidden> wrote:
> On Sat, 15 Jun 2002, Tim Freedom wrote:
> > There is a major disconnect on this topic if one were
> > to do any research on it (emacs+bidi that this) on
> > google or anywhere else.  m17n.org had claimed that 
> > bidi is close at hand (through its various symposiums).
> > Can't the various interests (m17n, emacs, xemacs, utf2000,
> > etc) unite and have one highly concentrated effort to get
> > this done with ?  Bidi's status is very nebulous at best.
> The principles of bidi support and the general idea how to do it are 
> clear.  What is needed is motivated individuals who wouldn't hesitate
> to study the Emacs display engine code, then hack it to include the 
> bidirectional support.  I'll be more than happy to help such individuals 
> and pass to them what I've written so far; but first I need to see them 
> volunteer and start working seriously.
> In other words, the problem is not the design; the problem is coding 
> (lots of it).  And since the first phase of that coding is to modify the 
> display engine, a person who wants to work on this will have to get a 
> fairly good understanding of how the display works in Emacs.
> > Can we start anew with clear indications of what has
> > or hasn't been done and what is needed to complete the
> > job
> I believe there's enough about this in the archives of this list.
> Please ask specific questions if something there is unclear or
> incomplete.
> So I wrote a prototype of a sequential implementation of UAX#9, in C, 
> which could be plugged directly into the Emacs display code.  The next 
> step is to take that C code and actually put it into Emacs, making the 
> necessary changes in the redisplay code as you go.
> As I wrote elsewhere, the problem is not to discuss what and how to do, 
> the problem is to sit down and do it.
> People who want to start coding the bidi support are most welcome.
> > Eli, what do you envision doing to speed-up this process ?
> Find more victims^H^H^H^H^H^Holunteers who would be ready to start 
> coding, picking up where I left off.  For that, they will need to study 
> the Emacs display code first, like I did at the time.

I have a couple of suggestions.

Sounds like the approach/sample-code/etc has all been pretty much
figured out and that you already kinda know what needs to be done and
how to go about it (in principle).  Could I suggest putting that into
a one/two page document and attach it to Mr. Schroeder's  "Resources-Bidi"
page ? At a minimum, if/when this subject rears its ugly head again you
can simply post a URL to answer all these rather common questions :)


After doing that (again, just some thoughts and compilations of whats
already been posted, nothing too detailed as that would be left for
Q&A's), I'd highly recommend posting to the various emacs lists (as
well as mailing-lists) soliciting help.  I'm sure there are plenty of
people out there familiar with the display engine might be looking for
a challenge.  The point is, having searched for Bidi+emacs info, no
where did I see a clear indication of its current status and what's
required for its completion, let alone a 'call for help' which is
where this effort stands.

With the various Bidi efforts out there and resident expertise, I don't
think this issue would fall through the cracks given enough publicity
about this topic and its needs.  Certainly Handa-san, et al might want
to re-jump in, no ? :-)


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