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Re: Is Emacs on Aqua crippleware or is it just broken?


From: BK
Subject: Re: Is Emacs on Aqua crippleware or is it just broken?
Date: 5 May 2003 15:16:34 -0700

Piet van Oostrum <address@hidden> wrote ...

> B> I tried several builds of Aqua versions of Emacs on OSX and all of
> B> them exhibit severe symptoms of crippleware. I would like to know if
> B> those are supposed to work or are they just bugs.
> 
> Apparently you didn't try the most recent one, the CVS version of the
> official Emacs as this supports most of it. I wouldn't call it a crippled
> version, although certain things have not yet been implemented. It is still
> in development. It is called Carbon Emacs. If you don't want to compile it
> yourself you can at least find an installable version by Enrico Franconi
> (http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~franconi/).

Thanks. I haven't seen this one before. Just how many builds are
there? ;-)

> So I will answer your objections with
> regard to this version.
> 
> B> 2) No Drag and Drop - text snippets
> 
> I don't know if it has been implemented. I don't think so

doesn't really matter as long as there is some other (working) way to
paste between Emacs and other apps, and as you say clipboard
copy-pasting works, so I won't complain.


> B> 4) HIG violations - quitting
> 
> B> On a Mac, all applications *must* quit when "Quit" is selected in the
> B> applications main menu (the one that carries its name). Further,
> B> applications *must* quit when the user choses "Quit" from the menu in
> B> the application's dock item. Finally, Cmd-Q is the designated keyboard
> B> shortcut for quitting.
> 
> The Emacs keybinding for quit is C-x C-q.

Yes, but my Emacs is deaf on the <C-x> bit


> The problem is that if you use
> the `standard' Mac keybindings you are non-standard with respect with
> other emacsen.

Fair enough, but the trouble is that the only way I can quit is "force
quit". that's no good.

> This also applies to the following items. Quit from the
> Dock does quit emacs.

That's good news, because the ones I tried didn't.

> Quit from the application menu is disabled, but
> there really is not much reason for it as it works from the Dock.

Then it shouldn't be in the menu in the first place.

> So it
> could easily be enabled I think.

Buyer: "What do you mean, this car has the breaks disabled? Can I
break or not?"

Dealer: "Well, it could be enabled, I think. Then you *could* break,
yes"

;-)


> The keybindings can be changed but then youhave to find
> alternatives for the rebound keys.

No issue in principle, but if <C-y> doesn't work and text drag and
drop doesn't work, then Cmd-x/c/v are all of a sudden very essential.


> B> Unfortunately, "Paste", which is now Ctrl-y doesn't work at all,
> B> neither from the keyboard nor from the Menu. Bug or feature?
> 
> In fact for Copy you don't need either.
> Just select with the mouse (I think transient-mark-mode must be enabled for
> this feature) and paste it in another application with Cmd-V.

I am aware of that, but it didn't work.


> B> 6) Emacs keyboard shortcuts
> 
> B> Most of the Emacs keyboard shortcuts don't work. Bug or feature?
> 
> What do you mean?

Well, I meant exactly what i said. Most of the shortcuts just don't
work. Emacs totally ignores them. There isn't even any feedback in the
minibuffer. I was lucky enough that <M-x> is amongst the few that do
work because this is how I get ILISP to give me a connection to my
external ("inferior") Common Lisp.

> I can use all normal Emacs keyboard commands.

Lucky you!


> B> 7) User Preferences - Fonts
> 
> Emacs has some special requirements for fonts I think. This area needs
> some work. I haven't found a way to select a bigger font.

Anyway, that's the least of my troubles.

but, thanks for the link, I'll try that version.

rgds
bk


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