RE: Java Swarm for non-Sys-Admin types

[Christopher J. Mackie]

Somebody made the point recently that Swarm installs more easily in Windows
than in just about any other OS.  Can't say for sure, as I've never
installed it anywhere else, but my experience with it has certainly been
reasonably pleasant: a couple of quirks due to my existing path statements,
a little trial-and-error (plus some help from Paul), and it was up and
running.  But as Alex emphasizes, I followed the FAQ and download
instructions to the letter.

As for JBuilder, you'll be able to integrate the JavaSwarm jars into the
JBuilder environment easily enough--they're just jar files.  You may have to
work a little to figure out how to translate the path and classpath
instructions in the FAQ into config settings that JBuilder understands, but
it's not rocket science--a little trial and error should work it out.  If
you want to do unit-testing, however, or when debugging in general, you're
going to run into trouble when the errors you catch come from the ObjC code
in Swarm rather than the Java interface.  Among other problems, JBuilder's
source-parsers won't recognize ObjC code syntax, so source-lookup is going
to be very limited.  Remember too that JavaSwarm is just a wrapper--the code
in the jar file is seldom enough to help you figure out what's going wrong
(in fact, like all wrappers, it mostly obfuscates the problems), so you
almost always end up in the ObjC source eventually.  With JBuilder and
JavaSwarm, ObjectiveC source browsing will either be external, or will be
internal but without any auto-lookup.  I'm sure you can live without
JBuilder's usual seamless integration, but you should know going in that
you're going to face it, and figure out whether it's worth the trouble.

FWIW, unlike some on this list, I like Java for ABM, but I'm sympathetic to
the argument that if you're going to use Swarm, you ought to go ahead and
write in ObjectiveC.  And the best environment for ObjectiveC is probably
emacs with the ObjectiveC browsing extensions (I think Paul's FAQ has
directions).  Trying to stick with JBuilder may therefore be more trouble
than it's worth.  When in Swarm, do as the Swarm-uns do....

Hope this helps, --Chris

-----Original Message-----
From: address@hidden
[mailto:address@hidden Behalf Of Alex Lancaster
Sent: Thursday, August 15, 2002 8:50 PM
To: address@hidden
Subject: Re: Java Swarm for non-Sys-Admin types


>>>>> "Russ" == Russ Abbott <address@hidden> writes:

Russ> I'd like to experiment with Java Swarm, but (sorry to sound
Russ> difficult) I don't want to get bogged down in lots of system
Russ> administration stuff.  Ideally, I'd like to install swarm with
Russ> as little muss and fuss as possible so that I will quickly be in
Russ> a position to do real Swarm experimentation by writing lots of
Russ> java code.  Also, I want to do this on a Windows machine.  (If
Russ> it matters, I'll probably use JBuilder for the Java code.)

Russ> Is this an unreasonable dream?  If not, I would greatly
Russ> appreciate it if someone would send me directions about how to
Russ> proceed. (Assume I know lots about Java but very little about
Russ> doing installations.)

Everybody (including "sysadmins") wants to install Swarm in the most
simple way possible, and that way is the same for "sysadmins" and
non-"sysadmins".  Check out Paul Johnson's FAQ for the goods:

http://lark.cc.ukans.edu/~pauljohn/SwarmFaq/SwarmOnlineFaq.html#3.1

It's pretty straightforward: install Cygwin, download some files and
set up some paths, just follow the instructions to the letter.  In
fact, most Swarm users are "non-sysadmins", and any extra commands
that are required to install are done so for necessity (it's not like
we add a bunch of "sysadmin-y" stuff for laughs).

If the FAQ seems overly complicated, well, sorry, but we don't
currently have the resources to maintain a point-and-clicky Cygwin
package (being a purely volunteer effort).  We would love to hear from
people interested in maintaining a package, or interested in providing
financial support to help us hire new programmers by joining the SDG
(email Paul Johnson address@hidden).

A.
--
  Alex Lancaster           |
  Swarm Development Group  |     web: http://www.swarm.org
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