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Re: Calling (package-initialize) sooner during initialization

From: Stefan Monnier
Subject: Re: Calling (package-initialize) sooner during initialization
Date: Mon, 20 Apr 2015 08:42:58 -0400
User-agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/25.0.50 (gnu/linux)

> I thought the point of this discussion was to find a solution that
> doesn't require that?

Right, but in the use-case presented by Artur, I can't see how to do better.

>> Of course, as mentioned, having `require' in one's ~/.emacs should be
>> rare.
> I think many people use `require' in their .emacs to load libraries,
> though in this case it doesn't matter whether they use `require' or
> `load-library', or try to call a function or access a variable or
> anything else from the package.

Oh, right, of course, the problem is not limited to `require' or `load'
(both of which *should* be rare), but also affect the case where the
user calls a function from that library (typically a global minor mode)
or needs to tweak a variable's value (not just `setq' it, but actually
take the previous value and change it).

> A user is likely to expect everything defined by a package to be
> available during the execution of their init.el; the failure to meet
> this expectation is why we get so many confused users asking for help,
> receiving the answer "just put (package-initialize) at the top of your
> .emacs".

But the current code in Emacs's "master" solves this problem by adding
"(package-initialize)" in the user's ~/.emacs.

> If nobody sees any disadvantages, and nobody beats me to it, I might
> start working on implementing the solution that separates pre-package
> configuration from normal configuration, including Customize.

I don't really know what solution you're referring to.  But so far
I haven't seen any solution proposed that's really better than
what we already have.


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