Re: Changes I've been thinking of...

[Michael Thaler]

Hi,

> Except I wasn't talking about code development with objc, I was
> talking about making apps that are far more usable without necessarily
> doing much more work to achieve this goal. The fact that those other

First of all, applications written by scientists / researchers are usually not 
written to be useable, but to solve a specific problem. Second, useable is 
quite subjective. I doubt that a GNUstep application is more useable for 
anyone having 10 years of experience with Windows-like user interfaces.

> systems you mentioned are "good enough" is because people don't know
> any better. They don't  have as much information on alternative GUIs.
> Apple's is known, but not well known. And both Gnome and KDE are
> basically Windows clones (interface-wise)

Sorry, I really detest this elitist view. Do you have any case studies that 
Nextstep/Openstep is more useable then say Snow Leopard. I doubt it.

> This is bullshit. The fact that the world has changed and new things
> are hard to get out the door is just your own point of view. Getting
> people to embrace a "new" concept as GNUstep just depends on how you
> do it and how much work you're willing to put into it. That being
> said, The whole NeXT interface was built to be as usable as possible,
> and one of it's well known advantages is that it's easy to learn.

Well, I am quite sure people at Microsoft will tell you the Windows interface 
was build to be as useable as possible. If you ask someone at Apple they will 
tell you there user interface is designed to be useable and the GNOME people 
will tell you all about their great usability even if you don't ask them.

And if you think it is bullshit that it is hard to get new things out of the 
door, why did GNUstep not attract users / developers? Why are about 98% of the 
desktop systems worldwide 
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_desktop_operating_systems) using 
a Windows-like user interface?

> I don't use Java or .NET, but the one person I know who uses Java
> hates it for lousy performance. And as much as a holy grail as it

Have a look at 
http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/u32q/benchmark.php?test=all&lang=all&box=1. 
I know this is not a realistic benchmark, but Java is not as bad as people 
(espacially people that never used Java) claim.

I guess, it is probably best for me to stay with KDE and MacOS X because I 
don't share this elitist attitude that Nextstep/Openstep is the best GUI and 
people just don't use it because they don't know it. I for one know 
Nextstep/Openstep, I even have an old Gecko with Nextstep but I still prefer 
something more modern looking. KDE seems more user oriented. From my 
experience they want to create something the user wants to use and not 
something they think the user has to use to increase productivity. In my 
opinion OSS products should be fun to work on / with. But I am fine with your 
attitude as well, as long as you don't force it on me.

Michael