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Re: use-package.el -> Emacs core

From: Alan Mackenzie
Subject: Re: use-package.el -> Emacs core
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2015 18:31:45 +0000
User-agent: Mutt/1.5.23 (2014-03-12)

[ Mail-Followup-To: set ]

On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 09:15:51PM +0300, Evgeny Panasyuk wrote:
> 10.11.2015 16:06, Oleh Krehel:

> >>> We should encourage the core Elisp to be simple to learn, because it
> >>> is actually very simple.  Not anymore so with macros like `cl-loop',
> >>> `pcase' and `use-package'.  They are powerful, but /they are their own
> >>> language/ completely separate from Elisp. They have their place, but
> >>> in my opinion Elisp newbies should not be encouraged to use them.

> >> Sorry, but I cannot agree at all.  That's like saying C++ users should
> >> not learn about the standard libraries since they should rather write
> >> their own.

> > No, it's like saying that it's OK for users to write Boost template
> > constructs and do QT stuff without learning the basic C++ and STL.

> It is OK to use Boost.Function or Boost.Spirit before learning every 
> trick used inside. Yes, you have to read their documentation, but the 
> same applies "normal/usual" libraries.
> Another example is Boost.Preprocessor - it provides high level interface 
> and uses a lot of tricks to make it portable across very different 
> (buggy) preprocessor implementations - but you can successfully use it 
> without knowing every internal trick and detail.

I think this part of the thread, although interesting, no longer has
anything to do with Emacs.  Therefore it is a prime example of what
should move to address@hidden

I have attempted to direct follow ups there.  This is something of an

Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).

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