Re: [Pan-users] Linux Pan crashes on exit on x64 system.

[Duncan]

Joe Zeff posted on Mon, 27 Mar 2017 19:18:48 -0700 as excerpted:

> On 03/27/2017 07:10 PM, Duncan wrote:
>> I run (a lite) kde-plasma here, not gnome, and don't pull in anything
>> gnome-ish I can get away without.
> 
> And I run Xfce, but can't seem to get completely away from a few bits of
> gnome such as the key-ring.

Well, xfce is at least gtk-based, as is gnome.  It may even be gtk3-based 
(the alternative being gtk2), as is gnome, I don't know.  But 
particularly if it's gtk3 based, there's a lot of common deps between the 
two and installing the gnome keyring would be a natural as at least some 
xfce and general gtk apps are likely to use it.

By contrast, kde is qt based, with kde-frameworks5 on which plasma5 is 
based being qt5 based (was qt3 for kde3, qt4 for kde4...).  So it's a 
different toolkit and installing anything gnome-based here will probably 
be a lot more expensive in terms of additional dependencies than it will 
be for you, as your desktop is already gtk-based, while mine is qt-based.

In fact, at one point back in the late kde3 era, I was very close to 
being able to rid my system of gtk entirely, with pan being the only 
major gtk-based app I didn't have a good qt-based substitute for.

Unfortunately kde4 then happened and the kde4 devs refused to continue 
supporting the still working kde3 even while kde4 was still very **VERY** 
broken, and even after promising there'd be support as long as there were 
users.

I did manage to get (and keep) the kde4 desktop, called plasma in kde4 
and after, working, but I was left with little choice but to find 
actually working replacements for most of the rest of kde.  I hacked 
together a multi-key-hotkey/menu system of sorts for myself, primarily 
using bash, and found independent or qt-based solutions for several other 
things, but irony of irony, it'd now be much easier to dump kde and qt 
entirely than gtk, as for kde/plasma the only real big kde/qt thing I'd 
have to find a properly working alternative for would be the plasma 
desktop itself, while on the gtk side, in addition to still running pan 
for news, I now run claws-mail for both mail and feeds, and firefox for 
the web, all of which I use enough to be "big things" in terms of 
switching, and all of which are gtk-based.

Tho most of them (including pan) remain gtk2-based.  I guess firefox 
itself is both gtk2 and gtk3 based now, but the others are gtk2-based, 
perhaps with a gtk3 option (as pan has), but no sign of dropping gtk2 as 
an option as well, out a couple years, anyway.

Tho of course chromium is qt-based and now its proprietary counterpart 
chrome is the most popular browser on the web, so I could switch to it, 
if necessary.

Beyond a couple years, wayland will probably be gaining dominance over X, 
and unless someone adopts gtk2 and ports/updates it for wayland support, 
eventually gtk2 and all the apps that haven't switched to either gtk3 or 
qt5 will be on their slow deathward spiral.  But firefox is mostly gtk3 
ported and of course their's chromium as an alternative, pan has a gtk3 
option altho gtk2 continues to be the recommended build, AFAIK, claws is 
working on a gtk3 port, and qt5 has wayland support which plasma is well 
on its way to supporting as well.  So wayland will bring changes, but it 
looks like I should be in fair shape even if many of my big apps are 
still gtk2-based ATM.

-- 
Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
"Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman