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Re: ‘censorship’ (was: libreplanet-discuss Digest, Vol 114, Issue 8)


From: 'smee
Subject: Re: ‘censorship’ (was: libreplanet-discuss Digest, Vol 114, Issue 8)
Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2019 04:52:28 -0600

The dictionary definition you gave has a couple issues. Notice that
censor is the only definition that includes examining. Moderating, in
the sense that the dictionary intends, is when people moderate
themselves, there's no examination that needs to be done (save for
internal examination) to avoid extremes of behavior. Moderators can't
avoid them, they can only censor them. Moderators are censors. People
can moderate themselves but, referring to your dictionary definition,
moderators can't actually moderate, (meaning they can't stop the other
person saying what they want to say before it is said) they censor what
is already said. It's not only the fact that it says examine, it's the
whole meaning of the word moderate. I can moderate my voice, but I
cannot moderate someone else's voice, by the normal definition and use
of the word. Online moderation is way newer than that definition.
Online moderation sometimes includes censorship.

Also, you're splitting hairs, censorship is censorship. And this is
censorship.


On Thu, 2019-10-10 at 22:05 -0400, Adam Van Ymeren wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 10, 2019 at 4:48 PM Dmitry Alexandrov <address@hidden>
> wrote:
> 
> > David <address@hidden> wrote:
> > > Calling such actions "censorship" is a very extreme reaction IMHO
> > > as the
> > 
> > very same core points could have been made in a less excitable
> > manner
> > without potential breaching of the above linked guidelines and thus
> > without
> > triggering any negative actions.
> > 
> > That’s curious.  Could you elaborate, please, why censoring due to
> > form
> > rather than due to substance is not censorship?  No dictionary
> > available to
> > me suggest it.
> > 
> 
> There is a difference between censorship and moderation.  If you want
> a
> dictionary definition:
> 
> Censor (verb) - to examine in order to suppress or delete anything
> considered objectionable
> https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/censor
> 
> Moderate (verb) - avoiding extremes of behavior or expression *:
> *observing
> reasonable limit
> https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/moderate
> 
> Nobody can define with absolute clarity where the distinction is.
> Sometimes the situation is obvious, other times it is more
> nuanced.  I
> don't envy the role of a moderator on an internet mailing list but I
> am
> happy that they exist.  If libreplanet-discuss were completely un-
> moderated
> and open to any and all trolls to spew whatever inflammatory nonsense
> they
> wish, then it would very quickly cease to be a useful place of
> discussion
> and I personally would unsubscribe.
> 
> It is not censorship for moderators of libreplanet-discuss to decide
> not to
> forward your message to everyone who has joined the list.  Almost
> every
> online community needs some level of moderation.  You are always
> welcome to
> write and publish your opinions through you own platform, which
> thanks to
> technology and libre software is easier today than it has ever been
> in
> human history.
>    On Thu, Oct 10, 2019 at 4:48 PM Dmitry Alexandrov <[1]321942@gmail
> .com>
>    wrote:
> 
>      David <[2]address@hidden> wrote:
>      > Calling such actions "censorship" is a very extreme reaction
> IMHO
>      as the very same core points could have been made in a less
>      excitable manner without potential breaching of the above linked
>      guidelines and thus without triggering any negative actions.
>      That’s curious.  Could you elaborate, please, why censoring due
> to
>      form rather than due to substance is not censorship?  No
> dictionary
>      available to me suggest it.
> 
>    There is a difference between censorship and moderation.  If you
> want a
>    dictionary definition:
>    Censor (verb) - to examine in order to suppress or delete anything
>    considered objectionable
>    [3]https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/censor
>    Moderate (verb) - avoiding extremes of behavior or expression :
>    observing reasonable limit
>    [4]https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/moderate
>    Nobody can define with absolute clarity where the distinction is.
>    Sometimes the situation is obvious, other times it is more
> nuanced.  I
>    don't envy the role of a moderator on an internet mailing list but
> I am
>    happy that they exist.  If libreplanet-discuss were completely
>    un-moderated and open to any and all trolls to spew whatever
>    inflammatory nonsense they wish, then it would very quickly cease
> to be
>    a useful place of discussion and I personally would unsubscribe.
>    It is not censorship for moderators of libreplanet-discuss to
> decide
>    not to forward your message to everyone who has joined the list.
>    Almost every online community needs some level of moderation.  You
> are
>    always welcome to write and publish your opinions through you own
>    platform, which thanks to technology and libre software is easier
> today
>    than it has ever been in human history.
> 
> References
> 
>    1. mailto:address@hidden
>    2. mailto:address@hidden
>    3. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/censor
>    4. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/moderate
> _______________________________________________
> libreplanet-discuss mailing list
> address@hidden
> https://lists.libreplanet.org/mailman/listinfo/libreplanet-discuss



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