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Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian)
Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian)
Fri, 24 Sep 2004 11:11:06 -0400
On Sep 24, 2004, at 5:13 AM, Philippe C.D. Robert wrote:
On Sep 23, 2004, at 7:45 PM, Alex Perez wrote:
This is a good point and, imho, one of the reasons GNOME and KDE are
more widely used - I remember using KDE 0.0.2 or whatever early
version they had, and I could _use_ it. It had a window manager, a
panel and a file manager that crashed every time I dragged something
to the trash. But I could use it.
G.I.N.A.D.E. G.I.N.A.D.E. G.I.N.A.D.E. G.I.N.A.D.E. G.I.N.A.D.E.
G N U S T E P I S N O T A D E S K T O P E N V I R O N M E N T
G.S.B.A.D.E G.S.B.A.D.E G.S.B.A.D.E G.S.B.A.D.E G.S.B.A.D.E G.S.B.A.D.E
G N U S T EP S H O U L D B E A D E S K T O P E N V I R O N M E N T
Seriously, it's not. There are several projects to *USE* GNUstep in a
gnustep-centric development environment, but what you are doing is
akin to calling 'kdelibs' a "Desktop Environment". You are comparing
apples to oranges, and not even realizing it.
Seriously, it should be. This is IMHHO the main reason for its low
acceptance, or should I say complete lack of acceptance....?
Seriously, it is. ;-) GNUstep is not just a widget library. It
includes mechanisms for managing resources together with binaries
(bundles, frameworks, and .apps), interapp communication protocols and
standards (D.O., notifications, services), developer and application
documentation frameworks, advanced color, font, and printing
facilities, UI guidelines, directory structure standards, and much
more. It has all of this because it was THE framework for the NeXT OS
and now Cocoa desktops. Gnome and KDE are still miles behind (in
design, not implementation), except in two areas: app component sharing
(Gnome bonobo and KDE Kparts, copying Windows ActiveX), and session
GNUstep could do session managment and Window decoration, except that
its facilities in these areas were not developed with coexistence on a
heterogenous desktop in mind. If every app you ran was a GNUstep one,
it would work, but not when you are running all kinds of X apps.
That's why we need WindowMaker.
I think some are getting the concept of desktop environment confused
with the packaging/setup of said environment. Neither Gnome nor KDE
are generally run "out of the box" these days. Instead you run
Fedora's setup of Gnome, or SuSE's default KDE configuration. These
are the parallel to SimplyGNUstep, etc.. Backbone and related projects
are similar to these in that they provide packaging and default
configuration, but they either innovate in trying to add that last
piece -- heterogenous session management -- or try to improve on the
existing *step facilities in other areas. This doesn't change the fact
that *step already has facilities (not all fully implemented) that
parallel just about everything in Gnome or KDE.
As far as lack of acceptance, I think what is needed is to finish off a
few existing areas that don't need much work but make a big difference
for usability, like Services and Help, and non-clipped text label
display ;), and improve the packaging. Perhaps also a "killer app"
that makes people want to install GNUstep so they can run it...
Message not available
- Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian), oberhage, 2004/09/14
- Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian), Patrix, 2004/09/20
- Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian), Adrian Robert, 2004/09/23
- Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian), Alex Perez, 2004/09/23
- Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian), Riccardo, 2004/09/24
- Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian), Alex Perez, 2004/09/24
- Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian), Markus Hitter, 2004/09/24
- Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian), Pete French, 2004/09/24
- Message not available
- Re: Starting GNUstep (Debian), Patrix, 2004/09/25